Episode 148 – Kate Rose – Relationships, Soul Connections and Twin Flames

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We've got an incredible show planned for you guys this evening.

We're going to be discussing love, relationships, soul and karmic connections.

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The Human Experience is in session. My name is Xavier Katana. My guest for today is Kate Rose. Kate is an author, thinker, and relationship expert. Kate received her bachelor's in visual arts education and her master's in clinical art therapy from Springfield College.

Kate has published widely on the topics of love and relationships, but it was her article We Only Fall in Love with Three People in our lifetime, which became a viral sensation. It has been read by more than 69 million people. She has gone on to attempt to

capture lightning in a bottle with her latest book of the same name.

As Rose uses this book to speak to those who crave both logical and spiritual answers to questions about love.

Kate, it is a pleasure. Welcome to THXP.

Hi, Xavier. Thank you so much for having me. It's truly a pleasure to be here as well. So, Kate, and this is your first book. Congratulation Congratulations.

It's amazing. I mean, we all think about maybe doing this, but actually having it happen is a very surreal experience.

It's amazing. Yeah, let's We're going to get into that. How I mean, how did that come about? How did you You know, how did you move into writing about love and relationships? And then how how did the how did you kind of spawn the book from that?

Um I think when someone's a writer, you are always a writer, even if you don't yet have a platform. Um and maybe that's true perhaps for any of our passions, um whether or not we're actually making money on it or doing something with it.

If we have it, we do it. That's what we are. And so, I always was a writer. And then I It was literally I I woke up one morning and I I had two titles for articles in my in my brain. And they were written by noon and published that first day. And that really began the

whirlwind of I mean, I think at this point between the astrology and all the love and relationship, I'm well over a thousand articles at this point.

Mhm. Um And so, it really I'm I kind of gravitated towards love because I was going through a lot in the departments of love.

Mhm.

And so, one of the best ways to actually work through all your emotions and feelings is to write about it. Um and then I was receiving so much feedback.

The number one thing that that so encouraged me was, "You make me feel like I'm not alone." And it was like, "Wow." And again, like that even ties to experience of being human that we're all here. We're all simultaneously going through the same thing, but yet how many

of us actually go through those experiences and those moments of feeling like we're all alone in whatever we are going through. Yeah, for sure.

You know? And so like that kind of just kept me going. And then, you know, I started coaching and, you know, speaking with people all over the world. And even that's incredible because no matter who we are, what continent, what country, what socioeconomic background, any of

it, a broken heart's a broken heart.

It's it, you know? It's It's If you You know, you can't dress it up, no matter what else you have going on, that that's what it is.

And, you know, so going through all of that, and it was literally I I had, you know, I'm a I'm a single mom. I had two amazing, wild little girls. And it was after dinner one night. We were sitting on the couch and the idea for we only fall in love three

times came to me. And so I had written something out, you know, it was a post before it even became an article because sometimes I'll just do little things.

And from there it I remember checking my social media the next day and I was like, "What happened?" Mhm. Like what happened with this?

And from there it just got to be bigger.

And the idea of it really resonated with people because it's something again, love is universal.

We all go through these. We have to go through lessons. We go through challenges before we reach that ultimate healthy relationship that not only can, you know, possibly last forever or what our definition of forever is, but also evolve and grow with us. And as we grow,

we learn how to do that in relationship.

Okay, so let's let's get into the dynamics of relationships. I mean, I I think it's I think it's interesting that this word twin flame is is being used more and more, it seems like. It seems like there is this, you know, without any disrespect, this woke movement that

is kind of talking about, you know, twin flames and as we were talking about in the pre-interview, um people, you know, you said that people are kind of hungry to connect on deeper levels with in regards to love.

So, you know, let's define what a twin flame is. Let's define what soul connections are, if you can.

Well, I mean, in the book when we talk about the three types of loves that we have, we really can categorize them as karmic and twin flame.

And the soulmate love is the one that usually comes and that's usually one of our first loves. Uh soulmates can be our high school sweethearts or the people that we kind of fall in love with afterward or or perhaps even come back to. I went back to mine.

Um and they're really sweet. They're there's nothing that's ever really wrong in a soulmate connection. It's It can be that person that maybe fits our family's profile or or idea of who we would end up with or even ours, you know, growing up that whole idea of

love is a fairy tale that we're fed when we're children.

Um And so the soulmate is just I mean, it's a really sweet love. It's not one that we're going to have a lot of ups and downs and a lot of lessons with. It's not one that's going to trigger growth itself um other than the fact that we're going to have to grow as individuals to

kind of move away from that. Um but it's a very stable love. It's one that a lot of times we do end up, you know, why people marry their their soulmates or their first loves because it's very comfortable. And so it's easy for us to kind of stay there.

Um after that, we usually all move into that karmic love. And see, the thing with the twin flame and karmic is that there's a lot of relationships that are actually karmic in nature that people will label as twin flame or you'll hear the false twin out there as well or soul

ties. I mean, there's so many different variations on this.

And the deciding factor is actually the real health of the relationship.

Are two people actually growing in the same direction? Because in the beginning, a lot of the principles between karmic and twin flame can be really similar. Usually there's an intense physical attraction right off the bat. Um there's a lot of passion

associated with it. And if we think about our karmic lesson, whether it's karma that we have to and you know, work through cuz we inherited in this lifetime or carried over from a previous, if there's not something really, really strong between us and another person, if

we're not having that intense intellectual and physical connection and you know, sex off the charts, we're not going to stay for the lesson. Mhm. So those relationships are engineered as such so that we're going to have that really passionate connection. We're

going to have that, but what separates that from the twin flame is that maybe you're going to have that connection. Maybe there's going to be ups and downs. Because that's the one thing is that even with the twin flame, and this is something, you know, it

feels like other people have one idea or the other. Either they hear twin flame and they think, you know, the sky is just going to open up and the angels are going to just going to start singing the day they meet their twin flame and there's going to be no issues and no

problems ever. Or they're going to excuse every single unhealthy behavior all because they've put that label of twin flame on it. Yeah, I mean it's a big label, right? It's a big label and like you and I were even talking kind of that pre-interview phase, there is a lot

of pressure. So when we're dealing with the karmic and twin flame, it kind of depends on how long we've been with somebody. So if we've been with somebody and it seems like, okay, every relationship has ups and downs, we still have that intense connection, but are we

growing together? Are we growing towards the same point? Um are we not repeating past patterns? Are we stepping into, you know, higher versions of ourselves? Are we acting from our higher selves? Are we looking to grow? Are we reaching that

point? And in a lot of those karmic relationships, they will dissolve at one point. They'll break down. There'll be some sort of chaotic ending or it will reach that point where all of a sudden we wake up and we're like, "I can't do this anymore."

And that's kind of like that pinnacle of the karmic, but there's also a very addictive nature because of the passion, because of the sex. So, that's where you get the karmic really is like that roller coaster where, you know, you can call your friend and we're off again and

then we're on again and off again. And that's really karmic. Twin flame, maybe you're going to have some hard times.

Maybe people aren't going to be on the exact same page at all time, but you're moving towards that goal together.

And it's not just a common goal in life, but you're also helping one another become your best self. Not by making life easy, not by being the exact picture of who, you know, our parents want us to be, not by saying you're doing all the right things, but by

lovingly challenging that person, by helping them unpack all their baggage that, you know, anybody out here, we all have baggage to unpack after we've lived a few decades. And so, that's what the twin flame really is and it's this the idea, the real spiritual belief

behind it is that the twin flame originated, you know, and this was his historically speaking, each kind of cultural area has its own, you know, definition or story about twin flames.

You know, in Egypt, it's Osiris and Isis. In Greece, it was the story of how humans were born with four arms and four legs. In Asia, it was the red the um the red string of fate. So, and you know, this is a historical concept in which there was one source of energy in the

beginning of creation. And that energy was split into two.

And over the course of many, many, many lifetimes, we are born into different roles and different bodies, only coming together in a romantic fashion in one of our last lifetimes on Earth because we have learned all of those lessons previously.

And so when we look at that and people are aligning with that, the twin flame idea has to look at, again, kind of even like your intro, looking at that spiritual aspect, but also the logical aspect because we're not seeing millions of souls right now

in their last lifetime if that's how many are saying, you know, we're in our twin flame relationship.

But if we look at twin flame instead as this divine relationship, well then it's able to be more accepted and be able to be more widely used by people in their romantic relationship because now we're using twin flame not so much as this esoteric definition of this energy that

was split, but really the epitome of an evolved healthy conscious relationship, which as a society we're moving towards.

Yeah, for sure. I love that you go into sort of the history of the origins of where this term comes from. I I think there's a lot to that. And, you know, I I've been studying this myself and I mean it but I but I want to know, you know, we I think I think we get a lot of our

ideas from mainstream culture, movies, television. Do you think that we've romanticized the notion of, you know, falling in love and and being like, yes, we all want to be whole. It, you know, is there a situation where a person will never encounter this other aspect of

themselves? Perhaps they have a mission that's that's higher. I mean, I'm just throwing out, you know, a hypothetical.

Well, you know, the thing is too is I I do personally believe very much so that we are souls in a physical body in this lifetime. I believe that I was reincarnated several times. I believe that I came into this life with, you know, a whole heap of good things and a

whole heap of things that I had to work through, that I had to overcome, that lessons that I had to learn.

And so, if we're looking at that with, you know, the population as a whole and whether people are old souls, whether they've been reincarnated several times, or young souls, they're just kind of learning the game of what this life thing is is all about.

Mhm. Not every soul does have that same purpose. So, not every soul has that purpose of reuniting with, you know, their counterpart. Because if you're looking at different people and where we're all at in this kind of game of life, if someone who is at a younger

stage, they wouldn't know what to do with that connection.

Right.

They wouldn't be because they I There's the idea of the twin flames, too, that the purpose and what And this is what I think kind of draws people as well is that overall as we've seen romantic, you know, notions evolve and relationships evolve. And yes, Hollywood definitely

had a part in that, but it was being romanticized long ago. I mean, that kind of in the Victorian era, you know, well before Hollywood.

People were really able to start marrying and looking at that idea of love. Before then, marriage was the only idea of commitment. There was no, you know, there was nothing else. It was marriage or nothing. And it was a business arrangement between families.

Sure. So, historically, there has been this shift of what what is a romantic relationship. And so, we've seen that shift from, you know, even like the the nuclear family being at home. And even still then, marriage was about social status. And you know, sometimes in

certain cultures, marriage is a convenience because it's just easier to share things together. But as we're moving and evolving as a group and as a culture, as a humanity we're seeing that people don't necessarily want to be married just to have children. We don't

want to be married just to have this person that we wake up with every day.

And we don't even necessarily want to have to be married to be in a committed relationship.

So, I think as part of this is evolving, what we're seeing is that people are suddenly like, "I want to have a relationship that's more than just this ring on my finger."

Mhm. And so, we're seeing that draw for twins because with twin flames, it's not just about the love. It's not just about the passion. It's not just about the connection. But, it's how can these two people, you know, there's like there's all these three entities. When

I'm working with people, I always describe there's three entities in any relationship. There's each of the people individually, and then there's whatever energy they create between them.

And that's not a child. That's not, you know, even a business. That is what else is there between them? Mhm. So, when we're looking at the twin flames, we have two entities. We have two souls who are coming to the table, and then we have what are they creating together?

And in the case of twin flames, it's something for the betterment of the planet. As we're moving forward, you know, we can tie in the astrology and the Aquarian age and, you know, even Uranus's new cycles and all of this. As we're moving through this,

we are looking at more spiritual terms of how to evolve. We are looking I mean, how many more people now are talking about their wounding? Are talking about triggering? That was something I never remember being around, you know, when I was younger.

So, it's something as a whole we're looking and we're evolving. So, as we're evolving, we don't necessarily need our relationships to fulfill that financial aspect. We don't need someone to, you know, buy the house or take care of that. We're looking for somebody that we

can combine together and make a difference in the world because now we're looking at a much global picture.

We've kind of shed a lot of those ego constraints, those dynamics. And rather than just having that, you know, big shiny ring, well, let's see how we can change the world together. What's our purpose for our relationship? And that's the part that I love that people are so

attracted to cuz it's like, yes, let's make a difference in the world. You know, how is that? That's an awesome thing. If we have so many people together in these relationships, yes, you can change the world with your love.

Let's do it. Hm, okay, yeah. I mean, I I can follow that. I can follow the part where, you know, you say that it's more than just a business transaction, for sure. Yeah, I mean, now, you know, once you have this this sense of, you know, economic shift, and with the advent of

technology, I mean, certainly social media has changed the landscape in which we connect with other people, right? So, I mean, Tinder, for example, I I mean, oh God. I mean, God bless your heart.

You're on Tinder, but, you know, it it has, you know, it to to bringing it down to the point of, you know, kind of like grocery shopping for you know, a connection with someone or something. Like, you know, you you just swipe left or right with your finger,

and that's as much, you know, in the initial phases, right? So, when we get into this sort of deeper connection that we feel with someone, what are some of the I mean, is it synchronicity? Is Is it a mutual recognition? Is it an energy? I mean, do you Do you Do you start to kind

of think and the same things? I mean, how does that work? How does the connection when you meet someone you would term your twin flame? How does that sort of evolve?

So, a lot of times there are synchronicities in the beginning. And when we say that term synchronicity, it can be anything from seeing the number signs, whether it's repetitive number sequences, or even a mixed number sequence. It can be something like a

song. It can be, you know, a time of day. It can be anything that's meaningful to us. Um, that we at one point have thought, because thoughts are real, thoughts are energy, and thoughts are messages. So, anything that at one point has met meant something to us,

that's like a radio wave that we send out in the universe. So, So the universe is trying to kind of wake us up and say, "Okay, you know, this is a time to start paying attention." we're going to get those radio waves back to us in terms of signs and synchronicities. The one thing

that we do have to be wary of is that the universe is not just going to send us synchronicities for those really great moments that are coming in our life. It's going to send us those for those that are maybe not so great for us. So those karmic relationships that

are incredibly difficult, they'll be sending you synchronicities, too.

So that's why we have to be very aware and conscious in what we're doing and not label things in the beginning. Mhm.

Because when we label things, we're not so much seeing who the person is or what the connection is, rather than building it around the words that we've already attached to it. So say we meet somebody and we're seeing lots of synchronicities, we're seeing great

number signs or angel numbers, we're hearing all the right songs on the radio, and then we start talking with them.

Well, as we're talking with them, there might be a similarity or balance in our love languages. We might even know what the love language is and might be able to share that. We might have that, you know, a similar or shared life path number. We might have overlapping or

there might be family, you know, birthdays kind of syncing into it. There might be similar names within families.

Um all of that would kind of be those synchronicities. Again, not necessarily with twin flame, but just letting us know, okay, whoever this person is as of now is going to be significant to our lives, so it's time to start paying attention.

We're also going to have an intense physical attraction for them.

And, you know, whether or not it's right off the bat, whether or not it comes through the intellectual and the mental stimulation, because that is one of the absolute hallmarks of twin flame, is the intellectual connection, which when you think about it, when it is those shared

bodies of energy, of course there's going to be really that same aspect if, you know, if we all are sending out our different radio waves, twin flames are always on the same frequency.

And so we're kind of picking up each other. So, the conversation's always amazing and a lot of times I've spoken with people and the twin flame maybe necessarily wasn't their physical type. Maybe they've never dated somebody who looked like them before. But then through the

conversations and the stimulation intellectually, that person suddenly became the most attractive person they've ever met.

So, that's definitely one of those signs. As we get further into the relationship and this is where kind of that true twin flame differs from a lot of what we're told. Mhm. Um what we're told right now, which really perpetuates an unhealthy

cycle of relationship, is that twin flames run. Twin flames chase.

God, yeah.

Twin flames leave. And when you really start looking at it, that's not really the basis of any of these spiritual relationships. That's something that as humans, which of course, you know, we can't blame anybody. We're only doing the best we can on any given day.

But we've attached these labels and these stages to a relationship that really only perpetuate that unhealthy cycle.

Love that.

You know, and so it is what it was, but for twin flames does it mean that there's never going to be a break up?

Absolutely not. But there's no running in twin flames. There's no chasing.

You're talking about a a very highly evolved relationship. Which means that as such, only people who are at that level can actually bond and sync in with one another. So, when you're at that point, when you're aware of your wounding, when you're aware of your

triggering, when you know what is still holding you back, when you know what you still have to work through, when you are that aware about yourself even if you're entering into connection with somebody and you're scared. Say you're you're triggered because you're not sure if you

can be with that person's needs or you're afraid that maybe you'll get hurt again Mhm. or whatever it may be you're aware enough that you're not just going to take off running and ghost this person.

Now, if you're in a twin flame relationship and you get scared, you you speak for what you want. So, you you say that you need time. You say that you need space to think about it, but then you process and communicate it.

As the twin flame goes on, the one thing that's usually pretty common with twins is that they don't actually have a strong desire to get married. Even if they end up spending their whole lives together, they prefer very untraditional types of commitment or types of

arrangements. I've talked to twins who even lived in separate houses after marrying, who have lived together without being married, who married themselves on top of a cliff. I mean, there's so many different kind of phases of that, but it pretty much looks across

the board that twins as they commit to one another, it is very what we would say non-traditional at this point in our society. Um and then they do end up kind of doing some sort of outreach to the community, whether it's something's through, you know, a counseling. I've

seen food programs.

Um you know, I've seen two people kind of set up and, you know, make build a school together. So, there's definitely this aspect of whether it's on a small level, whether it's on a global level, even just a community level, they do take their shared strengths together and

they they make something bigger than just them. So, that the relationship is actually serving a purpose more than just just this amazingly wonderful healthy connection. It's making a difference to the people around them, to the environment around them. And that's

really what raising the vibration of the planet is all about. The vibration of this planet is not being raised in leaps and bounds because of all the really big events that happen. It's It's not being raised by when we gather a million people together. The vibration of the

planet is becoming raised because we're speaking truth more and more and because we have people making small differences every single day.

Hm. And so, when we look at that and we look at the relationships of the twin flames, every twin flame that comes together raises the vibration of the planet exponentially. But even if you're not with your twin flame and you're still on that path of recognizing your

wounding and your triggers and you're doing that, that's raising the vibration. And so we have all these people who through their own healing and through this relationship we're raising the planet the vibration.

So, hopefully hopefully by the time my daughters get to be teenagers Tinder will be no such thing.

That's all I hopefully. But, you know, even with bringing that in, you know, some people might doubt, but it's like in every stage of development that our planet has gone through, of course there's the easy. Of course there's the test. Of course there's the challenges.

That doesn't mean that that is that speaks for where we're at as a country.

It doesn't mean that that speaks for where we're at as as a collection of of humans on this planet. It just means that somebody had a great idea to appeal to the weaknesses and the fears of us and put all of us out there on it is exactly like grocery shopping or, you

know, the human version of Amazon. Mhm.

Um and market that way. But, it doesn't necessarily mean that that's actually representational of where we're at and what we want as a whole for our romantic relationship. Okay. So, you know, there's a lot to unpack with what you just said, but one of the main things

that I want to touch on is that, you know, I I've been researching this for a while I and I had read some of the more popular articles. I I don't think I got to yours yet. Um and it you know, talked about this aspect of twin flame relationships and one of the key points

for me that I had a problem a big problem with was that, you know, these other people were identifying this sort of run and chase phenomena and I thought, you know, that's that's toxic. Like I mean to me it it just seems like that would only perpetuate

that behavior in itself when you're giving people this sort of idea of this is how it works, so this is what it should look like, so you know, maybe we should reflect that since we want it so much, right? And you know, but but moving past that, I you know, is there

a sense of I mean, clearly with all these connections, you know, the soul, karmic, and then finally the twin which is I guess what everyone's hoping for, but you know, there's I'm I'm presuming that there is a sort of gravity, there's something that pulls

you into who this person is and maybe there is even some sort of psychic phenomena that's that's happening where you feel like you're inhabiting the other person's soul, the other person's being.

Even if you're not in the same location, perhaps you can even sense and feel them. Um, what do you think is the biggest mistake that a twin flame couple can make?

Well, I mean and you even said a lot right there as far as, you know, what other articles have said and everything like that. Honestly, one of the things that I feel like we don't really even need to do for us, this book is really about self-knowledge because the more

we're aware of what we're doing and what we've been through, then we can start making different choices moving forward.

But in relationship, I think what we have to ask ourself is there any reason or need to label it at all?

So, looking at that twin flame relationship, of course, could we say that one of the biggest mistakes they could do is take it for granted? Yes, but that would be true for any connection. What's the biggest mistake that a twin flame relationship could do?

Could they buy into the runner and chaser? Absolutely. But they could also buy into any of the other stereotypes that we talk about relationships. But really for any sort of relationship dynamic. I think it doesn't so much matter what we label the relationship

that we're in so much as we use those terms and definitions to reflect on what we've been through. So that when we are moving forward, we're making different choices and we're coming from a different level of awareness. Because there's actually in this is in this what

I say when I work with clients, whether or not you call somebody your soulmate, your twin flame, or karmic as we're talking about them and as you you know, a woman is usually describing you know, her partner, her ex to me, Mhm. it doesn't change the connection.

It doesn't change the connection. Just because you said this is my twin flame, it doesn't mean that that's going to be healthy. It doesn't mean that the toxic behaviors of the running and chasing, coming in and out, lacking integrity and honesty, and it doesn't mean that's

going to make it better. Mhm. If she uses so So those labels as we're actually in a relationship, what we need to do really for ourselves is instead of going into a connection, I mean and saying that someone's my soulmate or you know, even telling them, you know, on

one of the first dates or soon after that, oh my gosh, I think you're my twin flame. Yeah.

Just hold off. Like we can know that. We can know that. If you really think that, that's amazing. But hang on to that.

Sure. Sure. Because there's actually no benefit of labeling that relationship.

And so many times we end up doing that and then we attach as humans we're still working through that idea of not having expectations because expectations do ruin everything. So I've seen, I've worked with people, we you know, meet somebody new, it's amazing. Oh my god,

we like all the same music, you know, our moms are named the same, you know, we have the same life number. Oh my gosh, and sex is amazing and he has to be my twin flame. Mhm. And so then they say that and then the relationship lasts a month and then he starts ghosting and

then it's like, well, well, now he's just in his running phase. So all right, now I'm going to Google and I'm going to pay somebody all this money to how to get my twin flame back to me and I'm going to wait and I'm not going to date anybody cuz I know he's coming back. No.

No. No. No. That's the quickest way not only to have an unhealthy relationship idea, but also to be unhappy and miss out on life. The thing that we have to remember is no matter what we label somebody as, no matter what we label a connection as,

you will know you will know without a shadow of a doubt if somebody is your twin flame, cuz they're going to come into your life with purpose. You're going to They're going to know that they're there. They're going to come in with presence. They're not going to be

wishy-washy. They're not going to be all over the place. You're not going to have to wonder how you're feeling. You're not going to have to wonder if this is actually something serious or meaningful. You're going to know. And that's the thing that I think that we

have to remember with these relationships is yes, it's a twin flame.

Let's have that spirituality component, but let's also bring it down to earth a little bit, because no matter what we call something, we're going to know what it really is by how it acts and how it behaves.

I love that. That's such a powerful note to add to, you know, sort of the end of your statement there. And I Yeah, I I connect with that a lot. And you know, there's there's a there's a quote, um if if you love something, set it free.

And I think that's so crucial. I think, you know, being able to give someone that freedom instead of trying to sort of micromanage. And it I mean, as a guy, if you want to scare me thoroughly and probably have me not talk to you again, just tell me I'm your soulmate within,

you know, the first couple dates. That does not work.

Me. I told you, me too. Like that's my red flag. You'll never hear from me again. Please don't tell me that.

Yeah. And so, you know, that leads me to sort of my next You know, and and I think a lot of people are navigating sort of we want this deeper connection in our lives. And we're navigating what the things that can be sort of illusory, you know, and the things that can trick

us into thinking they're deeper than maybe they are. And you know, I I I I don't think anyone enjoys being hurt or ghosted. And so, you know, what are some red flags that we can look out for in especially in the spiritual context of things?

One of the things, you know, that we really have to get is when we're meeting somebody, we have to be really really aware about are we seeing this person for how they're actually presenting or are we projecting our own ideas and our own beliefs upon somebody

and seeing them differently?

It's a really beautiful thing to say that we see the person, we see the man, we see the woman that someone could be.

But if they're not actually presenting as that, that's one of the biggest red flags that actually doesn't lie throughout the duration of the relationship. So when we're talking in spiritual terms, when we're looking at somebody and we're when we're having those beginning

interactions, you know, one is somebody able to challenge us? Are they able to say, "No, I don't agree with that." Because we also when we're when we're dealing with these relationships and we're having somebody constantly agree with us, then

that's kind of almost that people pleasing where we know at some point that's going to come in as a factor to the relationship either between the two of you or in a greater dynamic.

But it's also letting us know that if someone can actually have a conversation and agree and disagree and have suggestions and alternate viewpoints, then their sense of self is already formed.

Sure.

terms of spirituality, you know, that spirituality is kind of like that last stage of evolution that we all go through whether, you know, we grow up and we learn you know, become autonomous, learn how to take care of ourselves, we learn about money, we

spirituality is kind of that that last phase.

And in order to really get to that sense of spirituality for ourselves, that's not to say that we might not go through different phases or periods or, you know, if we're raised in a particular denomination as children or a particular belief, but to actually choose something

as an adult is one of those last stages.

But, in order to do that, we need to have our sense of self.

And the biggest thing that we need to do and and be aware of when we're in relationship with somebody or or even talking about possibly being in relationship, are are you looking at two, again, kind of bringing in that whole people. Are do both people have their sense of self

fully formed? Do they have their likes?

Do they have their dislikes? Do they know themselves? Do they know their limitations? My favorite thing is does everybody know their non-negotiables?

Um, as far as you know, apart from twin flame, apart from everything, if you're looking at your non-negotiables, what are your absolutes for what you need or what you need from a partner?

And a lot of times when we first think of that, they they're more tangible. Um, they can even be something that we would see in the 3D world.

But, as we kind of evolve on our path and we're looking at non-negoti- your non-negotiables, they do become more spiritual. They do become more fluid and they do become more 5D because rather than saying potentially, you know, we might need

somebody to be able to provide for us or guide us, you know, financially, well, now we need someone who can actually need us intellectually, who can stimulate us, who can um be open and willing to explore different venues or different aspects of

spirituality, whether it, you know, be you know, chanting or you know, different centers or you know, just openness, you know. So, as as we go on, that's what we require more or that what that's might be that shift from the 3D to the 5D.

So, when we're talking with somebody, especially in the beginning, you know, obviously, it's that sense of self. On the more basic level, it's are they taking responsibility for what has happened in their life previously? Are they owning their part? Because no

matter who it is, no matter what what's happened, no relationship falls apart because one person's a villain and one person's an angel.

Right. It just doesn't happen. Right. Um and so we have to be able to be in that place to own our part in it. Even if maybe we at that time didn't think we did anything wrong, it's not about being wrong. It's about how did our acceptance, how did our actions lead to

the event that took place at end of the relationship?

Mhm. And so when we're looking at that and talking with somebody, if someone, you know, is over over agreeable, if they don't take responsibility for past relationships, if their beliefs seem more dependent upon what we're saying, if they are having a hard time

disagreeing with us, those are red flags right there.

And then of course it's that is their words are their words matching up with their actions. So if they're saying that they're a very spiritual person, are they very spiritual for who they truly are authentically or are they only mirroring what they think very

spiritual, you know, in quotations people do or look like or wear?

Sure. Mhm.

So that's that, you know, other piece is that are they actually presenting as authentically spiritual people?

Um and so when we're looking at this, when we're encountering people, this is why that awareness comes in so much and you know, we all hear that piece sometimes that until we love ourselves, we're not going to have someone else love us.

And that statement unto itself is untrue. We cannot love ourselves and we absolutely can have someone say they love us, but can we have someone love us greater than we love ourselves?

Mhm. Yeah. No, it's not.

No. Yeah. It's I mean it's virtually impossible because we end up surrounding ourselves with the mirror. So when we hear that term, it's basically whatever level of self-love and self-acceptance cuz I think those two go hand in hand that we're at, we're going to mirror

around us.

So, when we're at this phase where we have our developed sense of self, where we do have a deep love for ourselves, when we accept ourselves for everything we've been through, when we accept ourselves for everything we are, our humanness, our supposed flaws, all of

that, then we're going to have our eyes wide open when we start interacting with people.

We're going to say, "Okay, this person feels important in my life. This feels like a connection that could be a twin flame or something that's meaningful, but I'm going to let the universe show me what this person is to me. Mhm. I'm going to let the universe show me. I

have a feeling, but I'm not going to decide, I'm not going to label, and I'm not going to, you know, have it be that the sentence down that this is it. I'm going to let the universe show me because that is the one thing is that the universe will always show us who is

meant to be in our lives and who isn't.

Yeah, I mean, wow, what a resounding, you know, thing to say. It's so true as well, you know, um where you are, how much you love yourself is what you're going to get back, and there's no there's never going to be anyone that can love you or replace this sense of

love within yourself that, you know, you have for you, and and you have to kind of be complete in that sense before you find this healthy connection through another person. It's never going to be something that you are going to be able to externalize, and it's going to fill

you up completely. It's It's always going to kind of leave you, you know, half half full. You're going to You're going to want more.

Um so, you know, a lot of people think A lot of people think that a relationships are a part parking lot, you know, you get there, and you you just say it's it's lazy, you know, and it's not that, you know, it and you even say this in your book that, um

relationships are a vehicle for self-growth. I agree so much. And you know, it's it's it's like some of these people that come into our lives, whether you know, they're soul or karmic or twin, I I think they propel us in very similar ways. You know, they they get us to this

point of the next evolution of ourselves. And so in that sense to me, you know, they're they're of equal importance. You know, it's it's not like Yeah, so you know, it's it's interesting, but but go ahead.

Well, and I so love that you said that because that is one thing like when when I've been talking with people is they're like, you know, they have that natural assumption or belief that twin flame equals better than soulmate. And that your karmic is not as good because it's

usually quite painful and you know, somewhat dramatic. And that's not the case at all because you know, if you believe and and I truly believe that every single thing that we go through on a day-to-day basis, moment by moment, is something that we're meant to

experience. It's something that we're being given and shown so that we can actually learn the lessons that we're meant to in this lifetime and so that we can become the people that we're meant to. I Recently I was talking with someone and you know, I love this great

term and it's Earth is our classroom.

You know, for those people who do believe that we're souls, Earth is our classroom. So we come here and we came here specifically to learn.

Some of us have specific paths where we're supposed to learn about different things, but love is something that we're all learning about. Even if we don't end up spending 40 years of our lives with somebody, it doesn't mean that we didn't come here to learn about love. And so

when we're looking at this and we're looking at our soulmate, what are we learning from our soulmate? What are we learning from even if we decide to marry our soulmate? What are we learning? Does that mean that the next lifetime we're going to meet our twin flame? Not

necessarily because maybe we're going to choose to marry our soulmate for five lifetimes until we can move on past that. Um, you know, even when we look at that idea of people will often be like, "Oh my god, I keep dating the same person with a different name."

And that a lot of times is like that's the karmic where, you know, people are like, "Well, I fall I fall in love like way more than three times."

And that's a lot of times like the karmic. Like we we usually will only have one really sweet soulmate love. Our karmic love can kind of keep coming back in as different people if we're not learning those lessons. And a lot of those lessons are those really sense of

self, like our worthiness. You know, for so many people I feel like either man or woman, a lot of what ends up coming up at some point is abandonment.

You know, our level of confidence. Are we What are we deserving of? What are we worthy of?

And so all of this, all of these loves are amazing because in that at the end of the day it seems like we have made this whole idea that the only reason that a love is amazing, that a love is beautiful, is if it lasts forever, gets down on one knee, and gives you a

diamond. And that's not, you know, love is beautiful whether it lasts forever or not. I look at, you know, reflect back on my loves and even even those moments where I was like, you know, in tears or crying, all of my loves have been beautiful.

They've all been absolutely amazing and they've all been exactly what they were meant to be because they brought me to this moment.

Mhm. Yeah, I mean in in that sense I think, you know, like I said, it it there there is a part of all of this where I think it's important to just respect the process of it all because I think it's very common for people to look at this sort of destination. They

forget about the journey. They forget about what the process means and you know, it's it's I think it's also how important is communication, what you say? And you know, it's because it's you know, I think I think right now with some people, you know, in my life,

people that I've encountered, it's or people that I've just, you know, bumped into that um you know, that we we kind of start talking, it seems like people are afraid to be vulnerable, afraid to express, you know, what's going on with them because

they just don't want to get hurt. You know, I get it. I understand, but how important is that aspect of communicating and expressing your needs and, you know, who what your Well, the the communication and, you know, the vulnerability ties right into

that sense of self with self-love.

Because if we don't love ourselves, if we haven't accepted ourselves, there's no way that we're going to allow ourselves to be seen by another, which really is what vulnerability is.

Vulnerability is the act of letting ourselves be seen. And so, when we're looking at these relationships and we want to move forward into them and we want to, you know, I don't think there's a single person out there who at one point in their lives or not hasn't

dreamed of being in some sort of satisfying, healthy relationship in which we're seen, we can have a great time with somebody, and we can have great sex. We we all have at one point, you know? I mean, let's be honest. And so, when we're looking at that, in order

to get to that, you need to know who you are first. You need to know who you are.

It's just, you know, no matter what, if you were going to go to a store, let's say to human Amazon, and you're going to go shopping, you need to have money to go into the store. If you're going into relationship, your currency of self-love and self-knowledge and acceptance,

that's your currency. So, going into that relationship with your currency of who you are and knowing about yourself, that's going to allow you to be vulnerable. Because when we look at people, you know, obviously there's that sense of fear, but if we accept

ourselves for who we are, then there is no fear in whether someone else is going to accept us or like us or pay us attention, because our level of love and acceptance isn't based on theirs, it's based on ours.

But when we lack that, fear really becomes kind of that magnifying glass of how we already feel about ourselves.

We're only afraid of not being liked, of not having that callback, of not being texted, when we actually think there's a reason why someone wouldn't want to text us back. When we're lacking that confidence, when we're lacking that worthiness. And then of course, when we

have fear, then that's when we start projecting and kind of, you know, that false sense of self like we talked about a bit ago. Even though we start mirroring what we think somebody else wants, instead of being our true selves, because either we don't know who that it

is, or the thought of it is terrifying to us. Yeah, and you know, it's so important because I I think I think growth in, you know, all all the senses of of the word that I know, it is it's going to be uncomfortable. It's going to challenge you. It's going to demand or

ask something new of you that perhaps you feel that you're not ready to face, but you usually usually the timing of things and the way that life kind of unfolds and works out happens in a very interesting design, you know, God works in mysterious ways. So, I I think trust

is is crucial to the process. And you know, really, if you're if you're really looking for this and you're you're serious about this, and um you know, it should be that you're looking for yourself, because until you find that aspect of yourself, it it's not going to

happen for you, you know, other you know, in other ways. It It might lead you back to yourself, but you're going to learn that the hard way.

Well, and the thing that what we end up learning on this journey, because when, you know, it's we set out to try to find our twin flame, and what we end up finding is actually ourselves. And so, that's what this journey really is.

And when we're on this, and when we realize this, I mean, I've worked with people where on this journey all of a sudden then they start wondering do I need a relationship at all?

Because when you love yourself, when you really feel good about yourself, you're not in lack when you're not in a relationship.

So then there gets to be okay, so what is it about relationship then? If we're no longer in lack and the way that I feel loved is no longer dependent on whether you love me, then what then is that connection? What then is that dynamic?

And so with the whole, you know, idea of the relationship, when we do feel that way about ourselves, when we know who we are, then we're looking in at relationship and we're able to show up in a different space, which means we're not looking for that person to fill our

cup. We're not looking to deplete ourselves by filling up another person's because of how they feel about themselves. Now you get two people who are going to feel loved whether or not they talk on a particular day if they happen to be busy. Now you have two

people who are going to feel secure in their relationship because they already have a strong sense of self. You have two people who, you know, are continuously pouring into each other's cup, who aren't jealous because they feel positive about themselves.

And then that's when you get those really healthy relationships. That's when you do get that twin flame. But the twin flame comes because we find out who we are. And then that whole aspect of, you know, how life works out and, you know, God works in mysterious ways,

it's interesting because the God working in mysterious ways, the spirit of the universe, usually tends to coincide a lot with us learning our lessons as well.

I've seen people literally kind of wake up and be like, "Oh my God, what was I doing for 5 years of my life?" Like and then within a month meeting this new person who they have such a strong soul connection with, who they have such a strong bond with.

And so so many times, as soon as we learn that lesson, you know, I kind of think of it as like we kind we kind of keep leveling up. And so, when we learn a particular lesson, we're never going to go down. We're never going to go back.

But, if we keep going up and up, then that's when more doors open. That's when all of a sudden the person that, you know, we've been hoping is out there, we meet we stumble into them at the grocery store. Or, you know, maybe it is someone that we previously knew in our life and

they come back into it.

Whatever it may be, it's only because we have found ourselves. We've learned the lessons that are necessary so that we don't repeat the past, and that's when the future can finally come in. Yeah.

Because God's not going to He can't work in those mysterious ways if we haven't learned those lessons of honesty, of worthiness, of integrity, of deserving.

We're only going to keep being in those cycles that we're meant to, quite honestly, to learn them. Yeah.

And you mean you really have to be able to close the door behind you to be able to move through the one in front of you.

And it's so important Oh, absolutely.

You know, it it's it's really important to understand that, you know, as as much as you're willing to sort of, you know, let go of what you think, you know, you know, and and you know, allow the this to unfold the way it's unfolding. And I that's important.

And you know, you said something so important there. And that's that whole idea, one of being able to close the door to your past. And number two, being able to let go of what you thought would be or even what you thought you wanted.

Because I think one of the most difficult things and of course we're doing a you know, we're doing this during a Mercury retrograde right now, which is kind of a famous time for exes to come, you know, come a knocking. But, um one of the hardest things I think for

people to do is they're like, "I don't want to close the door." First of all, I don't know where this door analogy came from. Like, there's actually no door to our past. I mean, we have to like pull up our big girl pants and boy pants ourselves and be like, "No, we're all

done with this in our life." But, we always say this, you know, we're going to close the door, this metaphorical door.

Yeah. Right. Well, I Let's not blame it on the Buddhist. I don't know if it's from the Buddhist with this. I don't know if, you know, they would appreciate us recognizing with this part, but maybe.

But anyway, so we close this door on our past. And, you know, what it really is, no one wants to do that because they're like, "Well, what if?" And so, we what if ourselves into this complete state of craziness of not wanting to actually say

goodbye to any exes because what if they change? What if that is my twin flame?

What if that is my soulmate? What if that's who You know what? What if any day of the week, but what if that person really was meant to be with you, they would be with you now.

And if they're not with you right now, then there's nothing you can do about it. And if it's going to happen, it's regardless of whether we hang on to those strings. So, that's something that's so important for us to remember when we're moving through these loves,

there's no way that we can actually move into, say that twin flame relationship, if we're keeping the door open to our karmic and soulmate just in case they end up being the person that we're meant to be with. Yeah. The universe is going to laugh us right out of that situation.

And so, we have to not be afraid. It seems like, you know, because we kind of lack that sense of self and we all want a great romance, we're afraid that we're going to make a mistake. And so, we don't, you know, often, unless it's those real big blow up relationships, we

often don't just cut exes out of our lives. We keep them around. We're we're friends with all of them now, you know?

And so, and then but that makes things sticky for them moving forward because if we can't close the door on our past, and I mean, as people get older, too, things get things get a little bit more complicated. So, now we have we have parents of children. And obviously with

that, we can't just close them out of our lives. So, it's transitioning the relationship from being a parent and partner to Well, now that person is a co-parent and a friend, hopefully.

They're a friend. Mhm. Yeah. And so, looking at transitioning those relationships, not because that relationship wasn't as good as something that we're going to have or because it was bad, but because we have to have peace with our past before moving

forward, because there can't be any, you know, we can love someone that we loved, you know, years ago or a high school sweetheart. We can love them, but we can't still have those pains and those feelings and think that we're going to be able to move into a new

relationship.

For sure. Because we're not going to be able to give our heart and our mind that space to focus on a new person. You know, there's a very big difference of knowing that we're going to love, say, our first love for, you know, the rest of our lives versus, you know, checking

our ex's social media wondering if they're still together. Mhm. Yeah. So, we have to be really mindful of that.

And it's also that part of if we're doing something, whether it's keeping a door to the past open, whether it's checking social media, whatever it may be, if it's not making us feel good, then that's also a really great indication that that's something that

our soul is telling us we should no longer be doing. Trust your gut. Yeah.

And I, you know, and that that checking the ex on the social media, uh, that's one of the most away from that. I mean, Please, everybody. You know, there's Nikola Tesla talked about uh the universe operating, the language of the universe being, you know, frequency, vibration,

those things. And so, when you're when you're holding on to a past experience or your past notion or idea of something, that has an energetic signature. You're holding on to that energy and you know, sometimes it it is the most beneficial to just let that go.

It's it's harder than, you know, it's easy to say, it's a simple idea. It's harder to put into practice, but I find that when you're in those types of situations, that gratitude can be a really good accelerator to Absolutely.

moving forward, moving on. Forgiveness, you know, it it's important.

Maybe you can speak on gratitude. Well, you're you're changing the vibration.

When you're talking about the vibration of everything, if we're looking at something as someone either did us wrong, so that's right away that's a sense of lack, that's a sense of negativity that we're holding on to that we're building our love identity around

these negative things that were done to us and these things that we don't have.

And then we're looking at now somebody's not with us. So, those are creating this whole idea of, you know, this negative, low, very heavy, dark vibration.

But when we start looking at that and we're saying, "Okay, I'm so grateful that I experienced what I was meant to experience. I forgive them for what what how I was hurt, even if their intention was not to hurt, because that's the thing too is, you know, when

we're in these relationships and they're ending or they're just not working out, we often will put that piece of "You made me feel this way." And that's not accurate because someone's setting out to make you. They don't have that power to make you feel anyway.

We have to own that our responsibility.

So, even if we're feeling very hurt in relationship, even if we're feeling betrayed or lied to or whatever it may be, that person did not make us feel that way. That is our reaction to the situation. So, we can forgive those actions even if we don't say it to that

person.

And we can practice that gratitude and that gratefulness for where we're at.

But what I have found is that when we're looking at that that gratitude and that gratefulness, something that we really need to have in order to be able to really successfully do that is hope.

Mhm.

It's really, really hard to be grateful for the really horrible, bad things. And I'm talking about I mean, I've worked with clients who have been every which way lied, betrayed, you know, husbands walk out and then after years, you know, unfortunately sexual assault. I've had,

you know, clients go through really horrendous, horrible thing. And so, to tell these people, "Well, just be grateful for it all." Right. You know, can sound really shallow and and hurtful unto itself.

So, there has to be this balance of hope. And when we think about this idea of hope, it means that you're looking forward to what could be.

Hope is free from expectation. It's simply the belief that something better could and will exist tomorrow or another day, in whatever capacity it is. Hope is essentially a very high vibrational feeling, and it's light. So, when you start having hope again, when you start

having hope that maybe you're going to feel healed one day, when you start having hope that maybe you're going to love yourself, maybe you'll feel love from somebody else, when you start having hope that life could be what you want it to be, then you can be

grateful. And once we can turn everything that we've been through and reflect it through that lens of gratitude, and reflect it through that lens of hope, then that's what ushers us into that pure vibrational sense of love. And once we feel that love for us,

that's when those doors for the twin flame relationship open wide wide open.

Boom. Yeah, love that. Um you know, my mom used to tell me that hope sustains life. Smart lady. And you know, Kate, we're we're out of time.

Uh we we've got a few minutes left here.

I mean, is there we covered a lot of stuff. I think we did really well as far as, you know, covering covering many of the questions people may have regarding this phenomena.

Um is there anything that we didn't touch on or that you maybe you want to talk about, maybe wrap it together if you like? Go for it.

I just really want to emphasize people to be their own advocates and to look for the answers themselves. Don't take something as truth if it doesn't feel like your truth. Don't be afraid to challenge what other people are saying.

Don't be afraid to envision a love that we haven't even come up with a label for yet. You know, and don't limit yourself by what you do read or what somebody else says is possible.

We do fall in love with three people. We fall in love three times. Each is for a specific reason. But there's also very many different variations within that and one of the big key ones is that love of self.

So if we want that amazing, healthy, incredible love, then we do look within.

And it's not that one is attainable without the other, but it's that it's going to be so much more worth it when we have it. And it's a journey. All of this is a journey.

It's one not to be rushed, but enjoyed.

So there's no deadline to learn how to love ourselves. There's no deadline to be in that amazing relationship. All we have to do is wake up every day, make the best of it, and enjoy the ride.

For sure. I love that so much, Kate Rose. It's such a I mean, such an amazing This was your first interview and I think you did so amazing. Where can people find Where can people find the book, your website? Oh, this book comes out in in 2020, next year, right?

So Yep, uh January 14th, 2020. It is available for pre-order now. Um you they can check me out on my website, which is wordsofkaterose.com.

Um this specific book information is kind of that {backslash} books. Um but it's on there in the center tab. There's numerous um dealers that are already selling it from Amazon, Apple, uh Barnes & Noble, um Indie Books. And so you can actually order the pre-order copy now,

um or wait until after January to purchase it.

Perfect. Guys, you heard it here. Uh that's going to do it for the show. My guest, Kate Rose. The book is called You Only Fall in Love Three Times.

It's a good read. I really love this conversation and I mean you would never know that this was Kate's first interview, first book. Go check out the book. Go pre-order it.

Um otherwise, that's going to do it for us this week. We will definitely be back next week on a live broadcast. If you're subscribed to us on YouTube, great. If you're not, click the subscribe button so you know when we go live every week.

And thank you so much for being here and listening.

Um if you can, get over to iTunes, Good night.