Episode 134 – Dr. Richard Louis Miller – The Healing Power of Psychedelic Medicine

Welcome to the human experience podcast the only podcast designed to fuse your left and right brain hemispheres and feed it the most entertaining and mentally engaging topics on the planet as we approach our ascent please make sure your frontal-temporal and occipital loads are in their full upright position as you take your seat of consciousness relax your senses and allow us to take you on a chip we are the intimate strangers thank you

for listening welcome to another episode of the human experience live show we’ve got an incredible show planned for you guys today on this day of freedom in the good old USA so sit back grab some of those freedom fries maybe a drink enjoy the show we’ve got planned for you guys today my guest for you today is dr.

Richard Lewis Miller dr. Miller is a clinical psychologist with a keen interest in the potential of psychedelic medicine to treat health conditions and to help us explore our consciousness dr. Miller has a concern has been a consultant to the US Department of Justice he’s been an advisor to the President’s Commission on mental health and he’s also held a faculty position at the University of Michigan and Stanford we’re going to be discussing dr.

Miller’s latest work which is a book called psychedelic medicine the healing powers of LSD MDMA psilocybin and IU Aska dr. Miller it’s a pleasure to have you here today sir thank you for making the time to be here welcome to hxp well it’s really fun to be with you on July 4th we’re talking about psychedelic medicine which hopefully is going to bring a new generation of people a lot of freedom and we’re doing it on our day of freedom so thank you for having me

yeah I mean wouldn’t that be something if we actually had the freedom without the possible persecution of you know being in jail to choose what we put decide to put or not put into our bodies dr. Miller let’s start off by you know give us a little bit about your back ground your history how long have you been practicing medicine at what point did you make the turning point what point did you wake up to these compounds as medicinal compounds I was I was in

graduate school and I heard about Leary and Albert’s work at Harvard and I bought their book the Tibetan Book of the Dead and in it they were instructions for how to take a psychedelic lysergic acid LSD and they said that if you take eight a certain kind of morning glory seeds that you could get almost anywhere heavenly blue or pearly gates you would have the LSD experience so my one of my classmates and I very soon thereafter went out

bought out the store from there pearl heavenly blue and pearly gates set up a time and proceeded to each eat 400 sees it wasn’t so easy getting 400 morning-glory seeds down by the way that was my first psychedelic experience that was in 1965 and and what I saw in that experience opened up doors I mean when I saw when the doors were opened up is a better way of putting it was was so as soul searching and so soul shaking and so phenomenal and words could hardly

describe that I knew that I had entered a new realm and the realm that had it was just obvious that this was a realm that had a great potential for human beings a great potential for discovery a great potential for creativity and a great potential for healing and so that all came to me during that first experience with heavenly blue and pearly gates morning glory seats in 1965 LSD was still legal and by the way okay okay and so give us a little bit about your

education your background how long I mean where did you go to school how long have you been practicing medicine tell us about that please I just want a credential this conversation yeah I’ve been practicing for well let’s see now thirty-four for over 50 years and as you mentioned in the introduction my my first academic position was at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor then I went on and I did research I was involved in a

research project for one year at Stanford University and it was during that period that I was influenced by the work of Fritz Perls and Virginia’s a tear at the Esalen Institute in Big Sur in California and so I left academia I set up a clinic in San Francisco and proceeded to do my work I also in 1972 I had made be propriety before I say what I did in 72 while I was at Esalen in the late 60s I sought it to study balneology balneology is a Greek word it means the

use of hot mineral water that comes out of the ground for healing purposes and so I started looking around I was very fortunate that the timing was right and I was able to find a hot springs for sale that had what people considered to be the most remarkable the most medicinal water it was called Wilbur hot springs and I bought that in 1972 and proceeded to work work on it and create a health sanctuary there while at the same time I was in private practice and

I was leading groups and I was pursuing research in psychedelic studies that’s amazing I mean that’s that’s a perfect parallel to you know push pushing or at least educating people re educating people I mean something happened you know in the 1980s with the Reagan administration and that that sort of dead reptilian Blink list stay that Nancy Reagan had when she said you know just say no and that whole campaign started and you know there was something

in the introduction of your book that you make very clear which I really enjoyed reading you just say you know what’s happening in America what’s you know what’s going on here and you start to go into the socio-economic conditions of maybe why these drugs may be illegal and you know what’s happening as far as their relationship to consciousness can you go into that for us like what’s why can I go down the street and buy alcohol

and cigarettes but you know not something not something else that might open my mind to per se well that’s a great question and since you mentioned alcohol I’m going to bring in something here many of your listeners are aware of the fact that in 1962 the Surgeon General of the United States issued the first serious and major report on the negative effects of nicotine and smoking on the human system and that changed the course of the

United States at least in the course was changed we still have I think 25 or 30 million smokers which is quite unfortunate but the world.the became under that influence of knowledge namely nicotine smoking is dangerous about within the last few months scientists from I think nine or more countries in Europe did a major study the biggest study that’s ever been done in recorded history on alcohol and the headline of that study is that alcohol is toxic in any

amount to the human system and this is really important I know it’s not the subject of our talk today as psychedelic medicine is important and I certainly want to get to but I I thank you for allowing me the opportunity to just tell those listeners that haven’t seen this report and it was published in the most prestigious journal in all of England called Lancet and it’s easily available for people to look up of course on Google and but this is a

it’s very important because on the one hand as you point out alcohol is readily available everywhere in the United States on the other hand the scientists have now said that it’s a toxic substance just the way it was determined that nicotine is a toxic substance no one has ever said that LSD or psilocybin ayahuasca or MDMA are toxic substances they’ve simply used morality and and misguided judgments and racism to make them illegal and as you also said in

your introduction you know a person it’s it’s absurd but a person risks prison time for taking one of these substances in the privacy of their own home when they are not going to hurt themselves or any other human being in the world but they do prison time for engaging in that act it’s irrational it’s misguided its political but it’s not in the interests of the American public to continue and I think changes are happening we’re seeing

change happening and that’s the positive within the last couple of weeks the United States government actually put in print for the first time in my career over 50 years the GUP to put in print that they see that there is potential for psychedelic medicine to be beneficial to people that was a major major breakthrough so I think I think we’re on the verge of a renaissance just like the country is going through a renaissance with regard to its attitudes

about tetrahydrocannabinol marijuana and we all know that it’s obvious it’s in all the papers one state after another are legalizing or illegal either medicinal use of recreational use so it appears that some change is coming after a very dark night than last over 60 years yeah I mean it’s it’s incredible how archaic these laws are and you know you make a perfect case and point for it in the opening of your book you talk about Harry Anslinger and some of the

ideology that he used in the 1930s to start to enforce these laws because apparently people thought that you know like he started to prosecute mean of Mexicans for marihuana blacks for cocaine and then there was this disinformation as you write that that people of minority people of color would use drugs to seduce the white woman and the public broad over this right that was the method that was one of the primary methods that Harry Anslinger

used to turn the American Congress away from legalized keeping these medicines legal and towards creating an illegal structure for them that was it that these these these minority groups are gonna use these these drugs to seduce white women and that just got the ire up of a whole class of people in the United States and one after another the Harrison Act and so on for marijuana one after another were made illegal that the medical doctors in this country many

people don’t know this but a lot of medical doctors in this country went to prison because they refused to stop prescribing heroin to their patients the medical doctors in this country at one time had the whole heroin situation under control it was a prescription medicine they used it for pain they used it they helped people withdraw and we did not have a big heroin problem and when heroin was made illegal it was taken away from the medical doctors many

of them kept prescribing and it went to prison thousands of them went to prison that’s easily available on Google also by the way because they didn’t want to go along with it but eventually of course the whole country did so the drugs were made illegal and we filled up of course what happened well two things happen when you make a substance illegal one you create a criminal gang because they soon make something illegal there’s a criminal group they’re gonna

be selling it and gonna make money off it so in terms of what you’re talking about this thing that Reagan started with his wife the war on drugs well what he created was the biggest criminal enterprise in the hit in all of history the cartels have taken over entire countries entire countries have been taken over by by drug cartels because of the opportunity they had to sell something that shouldn’t have been illegal to begin with it’s a similar

thing to what the Mafia did the Mafia took took advantage of prohibition to make their fortune and then when Prohibition was over they just moved all that illegal money into legal enterprises and they’re sitting fatback now 50 years 70 years later under their on their ill-gotten gains a similar kind of thing so yes that’s what we have we have cartels owning countries around the world and we still have this this war on drugs which is really a war on people as

you point out it’s not a war on drugs it’s a war on people and it’s mostly a war on black people and yellow people and people and people of color hmm Harriet Harry Anslinger was an ardent racist he was well known for it he he was known for going to Bellevue Hospital in Manhattan and having the famous singer Billie Holiday chained to her hospital bed because he was upset because one of her songs strange fruit was a song about heroin and so he

actually handcuffed her to our hospital bed and Bellevue that’s on record so yeah this is but but the bottom line of all of this and I think the most important point of all the things we’re talking about and it’s a very sad point and the very difficult point is that we really cannot trust our government hmm is the sad point we cannot trust our government because they are influenced by irrationality they’re influenced by money mostly term and they simply lie

and they lie on both sides of the aisle they simply lied to the American people and it’s a reprehensible situation because we cannot trust our own government and what that means is when we hear stuff on the television we don’t know anymore whether it’s spin whether it’s fake news whether it’s real news whether it’s news that the owner of the station wants us to believe whether it’s that the reporter wants us to believe or whether

it actually happened right so what they’ve done and I say they we can get into who they are but what they’ve done is really create a kind of craziness because craziness is when you can’t trust anything you can’t trust what you see you can’t trust what you feel is smell what do you do then and so a lot of people are suffering but I think let’s get back to our topic on psychedelic medicine and how that fits into this terrible political situation

we’ve created we’re gonna get right into that I just I just want to bring up one other point I just want to hammer this home I’m sure you know of Gary Webb he wrote a series called the Dark Alliance it was examining the origins of crack cocaine in the Los Angeles area and he found out this link between the CIA and the Contras in Nicaragua and it turns out the CIA was actually funding like all of this stuff mean the drug trade so

it was so you know there is a deep-rooted mistrust between what what’s going on with the people and then also the people that are in charge and making these laws for us for our own good I don’t I don’t see that anymore you know I don’t see that and they tried this with prohibition it just didn’t work with prohibition and when you push something into the realm of being illegal it doesn’t go away as you said it just turns criminal it into a

criminal enterprise and you just push it underground if someone really wants something they’re going to find a way to obtain it right so I mean maybe maybe people in many of the people that you’ve that you interviewed for this book dennis mckenna rick doblin stan grof james Fadiman had on the show we’ve had on this show to talk about this and you know I just I think it’s interesting that you know like like I said a minute ago that

anyone suffering you know from pain can it can go down the street and buy alcohol to numb that pain away but when it comes to something like ayahuasca now they’re they’re suddenly finding themselves on you know a 10-hour flight down to Peru maybe they’re dropping three four five thousand dollars to you know tour with a shaman they hang out for a week you name in so let’s get into the substances let’s get into you know LSD went where did you feel like what part

of your research indicated that LSD could have such a large impact on impact on PTSD okay I’m gonna answer that question but before I do I just want to go back to a point you just made okay you pointed out to it to your listeners that Gary Webb wrote this book the Dark Alliance which showed that the CIA was directly involved in the cocaine trade which is accurate right uh Gary Webb supposedly committed suicide sure yeah at age forty nine and you know when I

hear that a guy who exposed the CIA committed suicide my eyebrows both go up one at a time that sounds odd so I just wanted to make that point yeah I do know that what he was saying in that book I have personal experience with because I treated CIA people for cocaine addiction earlier in my career and I had inside information about what was going on down there and there was no question that the CIA was was in the cocaine business but

that was another you know one of the great lives that gets told to the American public all right getting back to the connections with the psychedelic medicines and post-traumatic stress disorder well yeah right now we are on a we’re in a situation where certain amount more of more research is being allowed remember for 50 60 years we actually lived in a situation were research research was suppressed research in the United States was

suppressed that in and of itself is horrific because that’s the kind of thing when I was growing up you think you hear ok research is suppressed in Russia research might be suppressed in China you know one of those bad countries who ever heard about research university research being suppressed in the United States well it turns out research is suppressed in the United States psychedelic medicine is one of the areas of research that’s been suppressed and

there are others but that in and of itself should tell your listeners volumes what does it say about a government that suppresses scientists what does it tell you we’re not talking now about cartel members we’re not talking about kids in high school making laboratories in their houses we’re not talking about underground situations or weird situations or doctor no on an island with about university professors whose lives are science and those people

have been suppressed for over 60 years in our country it’s it’s it’s it’s son Spitz and I wouldn’t have to say it’s unspeakable but it’s not unspeakable because we’re speaking about it and I hope we keep speaking about it until until the research is allowed even now it’s not that it’s difficult to do what you have to go through in order to do the research is is beyond your wildest imagination what you have to go through because of the way they watch these

substances and what they make you go through in order to create a research laboratory getting back to oh because your good question about the connection between the psychedelics and PTSD MDMA presently is considered to be the number one choice for traumatic stress disorder partly because we have more research thanks to Rick Doblin and maps sure we have more research on MDMA useful the research office of PTSD research on LSD so much

harder to find you have to go back to pre-1967 and there was plenty of research then but I just go on record as saying that right now the number one choice of the psychedelics from post-traumatic stress disorder is MDMA MDMA is is considered by many to be an entheogen you know it gives you a sense of a of a mystical or religious experience and it’s known as the heart opener and anybody who’s ever taken MDMA knows what why it’s called the heart

opener because it opens us up in a way that our defenses are down far and we speak under MDMA easily from the heart and it’s an excellent medicine for couples therapy and it’s an excellent message medicine for psychotherapy I was fortunate in that I was able to have MDMA administered to me by my therapist while it was still legal and used in therapy so I have a lot of I had a lot of first-hand experience with it and I felt its power and I experienced how

much it did for my own personal work LSD I don’t know if I’m prepared to say that LSD is a medicine for poor for specifically for post-traumatic stress disorder I would say LSD is a medicine for anywhere you want to take it because it enables us to see things about our selves in a very short period of time that might otherwise either take years or not even be available I mean this medicine and probably speaking to the choir because I imagine so many of your

listeners have experienced it but I would hope that they’ve experienced it in a medicinal way can add it to whatever they’ve done recreationally because medicinal way that we’re talking about on this program it’s the Medaille I’m not in any way besmirching or demeaning recreational use that’s a whole nother topic I’m talking strictly about medicinal use which means you follow a protocol you you go about it in a certain way and

with a certain set in a certain setting I to me LSD may be the tool that’s going to enable us to do self healing of physical parts and a lot if I may I’m gonna say a little bit more on that sir please okay you know that if you cut the back of your hand right now as we’re talking let’s say you just reach out or something and you scratch open the skin on the back of your hand and it bleeds and you and you touch it with some cloth

and it stops bleeding you’re very confident that that’s gonna heal correct sure okay most of us are over a few days it starts to heal and then ass Campbell form and then thus Campbell fall off and there might be a little line there and most likely eventually the line will go away correct mm-hmm who did that I mean genetics the human body’s ability to repair I mean are you are you trying to say that who did that did you do that or somebody else do that

my body’s automatic function is doing that right whose body’s automatic right thank you so so you so you did that you healed that wound correct her yeah okay and you used an important word when you described how you healed it you said automatic right you said automatic right suppose you were able to take volitional control of what presently is automatic suppose you could go inside with a laser focus of your mind and get an understanding of how you went about

healing that wound suppose you could with a tool go inside with the laser focus of your mind and get such an understanding of the biochemical electrical process that went on to create that healing that you could guide it because you understood it so greatly by watching it with your mind that you could then guide that process yourself and take volitional control of the healing of that wound if you could start with that then with greater practice you

might be addressing your kidney your liver your heart your pancreas or any other part of your body that needed healing because you would be in charge of what is presently an automatic function and I think LSD has the potential with practice to enable the human mind or perhaps I should say human consciousness bigger than the mind to allow human consciousness to self heal and that’s where I think the action is I there’s plenty of action of course the

way Steve Jobs used it with creativity with Apple and the we all say God used it with creativity with astronomy Watson and Crick used it for the discovery of the DNA molecule that’s all great stuff and I wouldn’t be surprised if he LAN musk is using it with Tesla which surprised me very much if he’s not sure in fact you you point to any creative genius around the United States nowadays and I’d say it’s highly likely that they’re using psychedelic medicine

to enhance their research work you know dr. Miller I think it’s really interesting in it and this is why I think information and the work that you are doing is so important is you know several years ago when we started doing this show we interviewed Tom Schroeder he sure you you know of his work you wrote a book called acid test I believe he even won a Pulitzer for something related to that work but I remember that day or that night after we

had recorded the episode and I remember just hesitating enough you know and thinking after I published this how is that gonna affect you know my career how is that gonna affect me and you know I just it was almost as if it’s taboo to discuss this and in times of change things are changing rapidly you know things have evolved and thankfully we’re coming to this point where turning point as you stated we’re now we are starting to accept the science behind these

medicines the quality of these medicines and it’s it’s no longer as much of an ideology you know it’s not no longer much of a fear there it’s still there you know but I think I think now at least we’re discussing it we’re having conversations like this unafraid we’re not afraid to talk about the potential healing effects of these compounds and it’s clear you know and I got a really amazing email one day after a show like this and

it was someone who had served in the military and she said she said Xavier thank you so much for putting out episodes such as this because it really helped me come to the point of a decision to – try it – to give it a try because she was suffering from PTSD she had served our country and she came back and she was broken she couldn’t sleep I mean she’s having all kinds of issues so how often does that come up in in your practice where people are hitting a wall

in their recovery and then you you know you add in this this compound that that helps them get moved past that I don’t know the numbers but it’s happy the story you just told about the vet is happening all over the United States and all around the world and I can give you many stories from my own practice some of them are vets some are not vets I interviewed one woman on my radio program who was who was a whistleblower at Fox and she was fired they ruined her

career and she had severe PTSD and used MDMA and we talked about it on the radio program and we she was a no person in the in the public view who benefited greatly but there are people who are not in the public view of their people all over the world the Israelis you know have done a lot of work with PTSD with with their people who have suffered because of the terrible things that are going on there so you know there there are breakthroughs happening

Rick Doblin thinks that that MDMA may be a prescribed herbal medicine either by 2020 or 20 21 so that’s gonna be a major a major breakthrough and it and what that means my breakthrough is that means that people now who are suffering and are not anywhere with their PTSD treatment we’ll have a medicine available to them that’s going to enhance their treatment markedly and that’s a wonderful thing it’s a wonderful thing for the whole

country I’m also hoping that enough people are going to get involved taking these various psychedelic medicines so that we’re going to see more of a consciousness change which is gonna then have an effect over time on the political situation which is not only getting it’s not getting better in this country it’s getting much worse in my opinion and and there’s a lot of of regression to a time of when it would things were a lot less pleasant and and

it appears that that’s the direction we’d be going in the last couple of years with with with how to put it support support for negativity hmm and the selling on an even grander scale of fear the public American public has been fed fear by politicians throughout my life that’s part of the name of the game they sell fear and it’s very sad it’s very unfortunate but I sometimes there’s less fear and sometimes there’s more fear being sold to us right now in the

last couple of years fear is being sold wholesale and some of it is just psychological fear that’s being sold about and it’s and it’s it has no basis in reality but it’s you know fear of other fear of bad people fear of you know Mexicans fear of Muslims you know fear of fear of our own species that’s part of the fear that’s being sold but the other thing that’s going on as you mentioned that I mentioned in my book the other thing

that’s going on that’s also that’s horrific is the continuation of something started in the Nixon Reagan okay which is a massive socio-economic stratification pushing the middle class down pushing the lower-class down further increasing homelessness because when you push down those at the bottom get pushed out literally pushed out the upper 1% of 1% of the population are expanding their control of the of the country their asset base base is

expanding the numbers are well-known there’s one family in this country that alone are worth the same amount of money as the lower hundred and fifty million people in this country that’s the Walmart family so things have been allowed by us we the people we’ve allowed them to get so out of balance that we’ve got this incredible socio-economic stratification that is just ruining our country ruining the people and one of the most obvious

symptoms of the pain that our country is going through is the fact that at this time as we speak Xavier 72% of the American population are obese or overweight the country is telling the world and telling itself how much it’s suffering by by hurting each person of that 72% destroying themselves with with by being overweight it’s one of the worst possible health things you can do to yourself it stresses everything there is there’s no longer any rational basis

for maintaining extra weight because we now have clothing that protects us from cold and we have heating in homes that protects us from cold and the purpose that the fat served was to protect us from cold why’s it serves no purpose and but what it does do is it costs us because for every pound of extra fat we have we have to supply it with energy and that’s like having a store that you have to pay for and doesn’t make any income you’ve gone

20 stores let’s say you own a hundred stores and 72 of them 72 percent cost you money and they don’t give anything back you have to survive on the other 28% how long can you do that how long and how long can this country go on with 72% suffering so greatly because they’re feeding parts of their own body that give them nothing back but what energy are feeding that that extra poundage what that energy costs is it costs the immune system because every drop of that

energy that goes to support that overweight could be used by the immune system and instead it’s being used to support a cost center that gives nothing back it’s a total waste of energy in the business world it would be like having a franchise that’s losing all the time it’s a it’s a it’s a waste of money that’s the situation we’re in and so the people of our country are suffering so greatly that they are telling us ourselves how much they’re suffering by

hurting themselves and showing it in our faces because when you walk down the street you can’t help but notice when there’s 72% around you who are obese or overweight it’s in your face all the time yeah you you can hide it to a certain extent if you’re taking too much heroin or cocaine or methamphetamine even there’s a lot of things you can hide but you you can’t hide obesity and you can’t hide overweight so let me let me bump in here dr. Miller

I you know I it’s so resounding every everything that you’re talking about I really connect with it on every possible level and I thought you know what a better way to celebrate the fourth of July other than to have this conversation today here to you know to mark our freedom today by having this conversation about the powers of these medicines to heal and I’m sure that you heard of this I mean hopefully you did but there was there was an event that

happened just a couple months ago where there was a 71 year old grandmother that was boarding a flight I think it was Dallas Airport in Texas and she had a bottle of CBD oil on her and I guess it was the TSA they arrested her at the airport 71 year old grandmothers she’s not it’s not a drug dealer and you know and then is it’s so interesting you know and just connecting with the socio-economic aspect of this of the the upper and lower class there

was also the this admission scandal this this Ivy League admission school scandal where these these kids were getting these free rides basically if you know they’re their wealthy parents paid and the guy that was brokering the deals he he received over $600,000 I think I remember correctly for for negotiating the entrance of you know these wealthy kids and when he was sentenced he got a day in jail time served and yet and yet Oh grandmother traveling through an

airport with CBD you know it’s it just it’s absurd but now you know it seems like I was surprised to see that Oakland has turned the corner on a lot of this legislate legislation but you know I do I I see it as such a it’s a small victory but I mean what are you really doing here you’re decriminalizing nature you know okay so it’s okay for us now to take mushrooms by you ask peyote and you know it’s it’s no longer I’m not gonna be in jail and you know

the the idea here is okay well you know sir you’re you’re ruining your life you know you’re destroying your life by using these these substances so here’s what we’re gonna do for you we’re gonna put you in jail so you can sort your life out so I mean what where do you think where do you see the future of this you know and yes Rick Doblin he’s a really important character in this story of for Humanity and it yeah I’ve talked to him and he does talk

about getting MDMA to a point by 2022 I think he said where it’s a prescription drug but and it where where do you think we’re gonna be headed in the next 5-10 years well that’s it’s a great question and I can tell you where I hope we’re headed and I tell you where I where we seem to be headed where I where I hope we’re headed is towards a Renaissance and consciousness where people look like yourself and the people listening to

your program start to organize because change comes through organization organization the reason we won the Revolutionary War was because of organization because Benjamin Franklin was one of the most organized people around and so was George Washington they were highly organized Benjamin Franklin started a group called the junto in 1743 ten people they met every week out of that group came the University of Pennsylvania the first fire department

in the postal service when people try to join that group Franklin said no Scott Jerome at one point he said to the other nine people in the junta each of you go out to start another jinto in addition these gentles proliferated proliferated around the United States and they were very important in our Revolutionary War because the Sons of Liberty carried word on horseback from Hunt Oh junto to gent oh they were the Committees of

Correspondence they became information as it is now was key during the revolution of making this point because it’s a point about organization it’s not enough to listen and beef it’s not enough to complain it’s not enough to hear these words that you and I Xavier are talking about and trying to wave the flag to the public that it’s time for a change all of that is great stuff but eventually when it comes down to is organizing and sharing information the

telephones the cell phones are tremendous pieces of equipment for that because of the rapidity of sharing of information and because the average person now can take a photograph and share it with the world those are huge steps that make organization more possible but even these words that I’m speaking to a government are dangerous words because because the government does not want people organizing the reason the government is more powerful than anybody

else is because it has AG larger organization and the reason the corporation’s now own the government is because the corporation is an extremely organized a really organized group of people they have a structure they have a power structure they have job delegation they have franchises the word can go from the top to the bottom to the left to the right extremely rapidly and people can all be moved in a certain direction that is organization you know

sorry that’s what it said to your question what is it going to take to change it gonna take organization and communication and it can be done but it’s a monumental it’s a big task but you know what beating beating England which was the greatest country in the world for us to beat them in a revolutionary war with it with a group of basically a group of farmers who knew how to shoot guns that was quite a feat in and of itself as well so we’ve done

it before we’ve done it before and I do I’m gonna make a little comment you said earlier in the introduction something about Liberty fries on and and I want I want to take exception to that I’m not blaming you but these politicians who turn their back on France because France wouldn’t join us in some fight somewhere else in the world and all of its we have the audacity to change french fries to liberty fries memories are too short

because without the french we would not have won the Revolutionary War it was their Navy that fought the British Navy that was blockading us and stopping us from getting help and when they when their French Navy did that that was a huge help and and when the Marquis de Lafayette a 21 year old kid a young man I should say came here he brought I think he bought what is something like what nowadays would be a billion dollars and a small army people don’t know that

he didn’t just drop over himself and the he was so close to the king of France that for him to be here at Washington’s side was was huge so that when Ben Franklin went to the King of France to try to get him to join us and he worked on it until he finally succeeded the fact that Lafayette was here was a really big deal well that’s a story about winning and I’m saying we won before against odds that nobody could believe were possible we could win again

but we better get organized because the other side that’s keeping us in the dark secrets of the night are very organized sure they’re they’re heavily funded they’re very well funded by these megalithic corporations and in the name of profit there are pushing legislation that affects us on in an everyday basis and you know I I it reminds me of a quote I’m gonna paraphrase this I might butcher this but it’s from the Dali Lama and he says if you think you’re too

small to make a difference just to remember the last time that there was a mosquito in your room before you fell asleep so so it’s it’s not that we’re too small and I think that’s that’s the error in thinking you know that’s the that sometimes that that that little voice in our minds that says you know no I’m not big enough to make a difference and my voice doesn’t make a difference it does your voice does make a difference and you know there was

something in your book that I loved it’s it’s something you said about Thomas Jefferson and you said that Thomas Jefferson told us over 200 years ago that the Constitution should be rewritten every 20 years for every new generation because it gets out of date right and you know I agree with this you know I really see this and you know hopefully hopefully we get it together because you know I I don’t I would you know I would be I don’t know where

things would be for the next generation the generation after that if we don’t do something here and now and beyond just these words in North Korea there are prisons called the prison of three generations and what that means is if a man gets arrested and sent to prison everybody in his family of his generation goes to prison with him but everybody in his family above him meaning his parents and his grey parents and his children they all go to

prison as well so they wipe out three generations of a family all the cousins all the brothers all the sisters all the aunts all the uncles all the children three generations right across get wiped out and they send them to these prisons and what has happened there is that people are born there live their whole lives there and they die there and they believe that that is life that is life they don’t know anything out that goes

on outside of that those prisons the stories that come out of there are stories of a system whereby what we call ratting is rewarded that’s that one of the best things you can possibly do and they’ve got turning each other in as such a highly rewarded thing that people turn in their own parents for infractions knowing that their parents will be shot in front of them and when their parents are shot in front of them the reaction of the children is to be

happy because they believe that they have done the right thing they have told on their parents and their parents were properly executed and eliminated I’m telling the story because it’s a story of what is happening on this planet it’s a story of to a certain extent of what happened in Russia between 1917 after the Revolution and when the the Soviet Union came apart on to Gorbachev seventy years later people will and died believing that the world was

the way they saw it around them and that’s what it was and it is in the prison of three generations and what I’m saying to you is if we don’t do something about the situation we’re in we will be the prison of three generations because in a few generations they won’t know any different they’ll be fewer and fewer to remind them that there are other ways of living where love can trump fear but if you don’t even know there’s such a thing as

love and you were born and raised and died and lived your entire life and the only emotion that the predominant emotion was fear that’s what life is there’s nothing to compare it to it’s sort of like the story of Vladimir Horowitz being asked what was it like growing up as a prodigy and he said I have no idea I had nothing to compare it to it’s I I love your words dr. Miller and you know I I’m so glad I know we kind of you know spent a lot of time in

this conversation just talking about the the socio-economic conditions of what’s going on here and the political aspects of this but I think the the legislation of this is something that we really need to address and look at and we how much time do we have left exam you have six minutes left let me see if I could say a couple of more words about psychedelic medicine in my book and because you know that was our topic please do okay I

think the greatest potential in the psychedelic medicines that as I see them right now are in LSD and MDMA psilocybin appears to have a lot of potential as well particularly for depression I have some concerns about it as a medicine not because I it’s dangerous in any way but because with a relatively high percentage of people it has a side effect which is nausea and and discomfort and that’s a big thing for a lot of people to get

over you move down one or not down but along the line two ayahuasca and there you have a major side effect of stomach upset that leads to sometimes explosive regurgitation so much so that in ayahuasca circles it’s quite common for everybody every person who’s sitting in the circle that’s going to ingest ayahuasca to have a bowl to throw up into so I have reservations about that as a medicine also because of the of the severity of the of the regurgitation and

also because I I don’t buy into the the the the the psychobabble that the reason for the regurgitation is that you’re throwing up psychological junk from the past sure the reason you’re throwing up is because ayahuasca is an emetic it makes human beings puke pure and simple I got that from Steven Beyer who wrote the book talking to the plants Dennis McKenna has also verified that the famous ethno botanist that you mentioned you’ve had on your show I’ve

had him on my show it’s an emetic it makes you throw up so that’s a side effect that doesn’t mean it’s a bad medicine or a dangerous medicine but it means a lot of people are gonna have to deal with that I’m a realist and a pragmatist for me that the best kind of medicine is a medicine that causes the least discomfort and gives the most effect and if you if you have to fight your way through negative effects whether it’s vomiting or

headaches or various other kinds of things you got a fight on your hands let’s see if we can find something better we don’t have those kind of effects there are some effects that some people have with MDMA and LSD it’s pretty rare as Dave Nichols you know one of the greatest pioneers in research of psychedelic medicine said on my program you may have had him on yourself nobody’s ever died from LSD hmm hmm very simple no one there’s no recorded death

from LSD that’s a very important thing for the public to know because there’s so many these rumors that have gone on and we’re talking about I had a patient of mine took took 10 times 10 times a normal dose of LSD took two thousand micrograms and he had a big experience but he sure as heck didn’t die and he didn’t end up in the emergency room I’m not here to tell you that I think people should go out and do that by any means definitely I’m using it as an example er

how far somebody could go with this and still you know be okay it’s it’s not a lethal medicine in other words that’s important to know because of all the disinformation that’s been out there I want to say that if your listeners have not had experience with these medicines and they’re thinking of doing so in addition to my book which i think is worth reading because you have the best scientists in the United States telling it as it is and you’ve had many of them

on your program Xavier and the other book to read is Jim Fatima’s the psychedelic explorers guide have you had him on your program you have sure okay great then I’m just validating with you that book what book is a must because that my book tells you what the scientists are telling you Jim’s book tells you that’s the recipe how to and you want to follow the how-to because when you follow the how-to you’re taking a substance and you’re using it

medicinally right I mean that’s I think you know yeah I love the book and I loved the the format in which you used and just going right to the source you’re going to the people that are making the changes in in this community and this movement I think it’s important to note that you know in in the 90s and during the just say no to drugs campaign we were given this model of the which was that once you once gray cells or gray matter in the brain was gone it

never came back right and then in the early 2000s uh scientists started to pick up on this idea of neurogenesis and they found out that psilocybin I you ask LSD these types of compounds were actually regrowing parts of the brain yes so you know I think it’s important to re-educate the people into an awareness of how the science has changed you know the stuff that we were told when we were growing up and for my generation it just it flat-out is wrong

it’s a propaganda you know reefer madness I mean that that was propaganda as well the stuff you were told Xavier was misleading it was erroneous it was wrong pure and simple and it’s a new day there’s a renaissance going on and programs like yours and I thank you very much for having your program because you’re one of the mosquitos in the room that’s help if you want you’re one of the mosquitos in the room that’s helping keep keep us awake and we need to be

awake dr. Miller I love it thank you so much for your time today on this holiday giving us your time with this amazing read I really do recommend picking up this book guys it’s a really great way to get into what these medicines can do for you dr. Miller where can people go and find your work where the website where can they go well we have a website the psychedelic medicine book and you can go to that easy to find me on Google

dr. Richard Lewis Miller you’ve got to use my middle name dr. Richard Lewis ello you is Miller the book psychedelic medicine is easily available on Amazon Xavier so you know that’s the easiest place to get to it will make that link available for people and then you’re a broadcaster as well you have your own show so why don’t you plug that as well oh that’s kind of you my program is called mind-body health and politics and Xavier and I have in

interviewed many of the same people and it’s worth hearing them on his program I love the job you’re doing you Savior you doing a great job it’s been a lovely interview with you I’ve enjoyed it immensely and mind-body Health & Politics is my program and you can see a lot of interesting programs that I’ve archived on there that I think you’ll find them interesting and some of them quite educational dr. Miller have you ever last last thing

for you here have you ever gotten the comparison because I’m looking at this picture of you which were broadcasting right now have you ever gotten the comparison to Bryan Cranston of Breaking Bad Walter White you look like that guy do you have you ever gotten that comparison I a lot of people have told Bryan Cranston that he looks like me I know that and and sometimes he kids me about it because how many people tell him that and that’s about all I know

about it okay all right fair enough guys you heard it here we’re gonna get out of here thank you so much if you’re listening to this this broadcast my guest his name is dr. Richard Lewis Miller the book is called psychedelic medicine the healing powers of LSD MDMA psilocybin and ayahuasca highly recommend going and picking up this book and giving it a read I really enjoyed it we are gonna get out of here if you are listening to this on the youtube version

please click subscribe click the bell that way you know when we go live if you’re listening to this on the podcast version go over to iTunes leave us a review and help us you know stay relevant so that people can find the show and learn more about it the biggest compliment that you can give us at for this show is when you share it with your family and friends I hope that you enjoy that the work that we’re putting in we put a lot of work into doing this thank

you so much for listening we will be back next week

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