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strangers thank you for listening what’s

up folks

Xavier katana here with another home run

episode

this is mrs. Elizabeth lesser she is the

founder of the Omega Institute and

author of her new book marrow a love

story all I can say about this

conversation is wow it felts like

speaking to a long-lost old friend that

I hadn’t seen or heard from in in a long

time and the conversation flowed so

seamlessly and there’s a vibe or a

presence that Elizabeth has that you

feel immediately and it is just a

calming resonance that hopefully

translates through this this recording

please pick up a copy of her book marrow

a love story it is truly a great read

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either way without much further ado here

is

one of the best episodes we’ve done

hands down mrs. Elizabeth lesser thank

you guys so much for listening the human

experience in session our guest today is

mrs. Elizabeth lesser Elizabeth

welcome to hxp thank you thanks for

having me

Elizabeth I I admire your work so much

starting from co-founding the Omega

Institute in 1977 you have such a wide

history and can you kind of lay the

foundation for anyone who may not know

who you are please okay well that’s what

I’ve been trying to figure out my whole

life Who am I

but what I’ve done what I’ve done as

opposed to Who I am

is well very young in my early 20s a

bunch of us were studying with a

spiritual teacher it was that time in

American history when everything was in

flux and you know politically and

socially and it was also the time when

these gurus from the East were washing

up on the shores of America and I was

raised in an atheist intellectual family

and all I ever wanted was as a kid was

to have a spiritual life I don’t know

where it came from

but when those gurus started making it

to the cover of Time magazine and I was

still in high school I was like I want

one of them and I went to college and

but what I really wanted to do was to

find a spiritual teacher and when I was

19 I did and he was an amazing man with

it like a renaissance kind of man an

Eastern teacher but a Western thinker as

well and it was his idea to start a

school of holistic studies and a lot of

what we were interested in at that time

was way at the fringe of American

culture things like yoga and meditation

and food as

medicine and natural foods and

alternative healing things that are very

much part of American culture now

Western culture but weren’t then and

that was his idea put myself and my

ex-husband in charge of starting this

school and we had no idea that Omega

Institute as we called it would turn

into what it is today

30,000 people come every year to our

workshops and trainings and we offer

like a very wide array of workshops to

people from all over the world we didn’t

know that that’s what we’d be starting

then but that is what ended up happening

yeah

Omega is so huge from Maya Angelou to

Deepak Chopra to ROM das to Eckhart

Tolle there’s so many visionaries that

are kind of part of what you’re doing

and I’m just digging right in here and

if there’s there’s one specific thing

that kind of defines you through all of

your hurdles and with with setting up

this this sort of Institute and the

books you’ve written I mean you’re a

best-selling author and just everything

that you’ve done your life what would

you say is that would be the defining

moment of that you know some people have

had an awakening in a defining moment

like you mentioned Eckhart Tolle and

people who say like I woke up and then I

was enlightened like that’s I I have not

had that experience I I would say the

defining experience for me which is

still going on is that we are all this

we are all the same we are so similar

people will say to me what’s it like

being around all those great spiritual

teachers and scientists and artists and

famous people and oh my god you must

have met such amazing people and and I

forever even when I was 21 years old and

starting

megha and even becoming a best-selling

author my experience has always been

everyone even the wisest among us the

Dalai Lama and Eckhart Tolle A’s and

whomever we’re all the same everyone

struggles everyone gets confused

no one is nice and good all the time we

get up we we vow that we’re going to put

into practice the wisdom we know and we

fail and we try again and I’ve learned

this by being around people who others

put on pedestals and I’ve seen them fall

and I’ve seen their paradoxes and

inconsistencies and what it’s given me

is a great sense of compassion toward

myself for my imperfections and toward

other people I I am NOT after perfection

I’m after authenticity and that’s what I

value in people and I think that is what

I have learned over my years of being a

seeker I think more and more

authenticity seems to be the current the

current kind of currency

I mean without authenticity of what do

we really what do you really have and

why are we doing it who are we trying to

impress and what do you get after you’ve

impressed other people you still left

with your life and yourself Elizabeth

you’ve written marrow this new book

which which actually details your your

actual help of your you were helping

your sister by donating marrow to her

and this affected you on both a

spiritual level and a physical level I

mean can you tell us more about this yes

my younger sister I come from a family

of four girls and the sister right next

to me very close in age her name is

Maggie had gotten seven years previously

a virulent strain of lymphoma and she’d

gone into remission for seven years but

then it came back and when a cancer

comes back as

you all probably know it’s very hard to

treat it again and so this time she

needed a bone marrow transplant and

siblings are the best bet for tissue

match so all the siblings got tested and

we were very surprised when it turned

out that the person who tested a perfect

match was me and I was surprised because

my sister Maggie and I were very

different kinds of people and we loved

each other but we also had a you know

kind of a rich typical sibling history

of being friends and being strangers and

betraying each other and loving each

other and the whole thing that siblings

go through and when I studied up on what

it meant to be a bone marrow donor and

to be a bone marrow recipient I I was

intrigued to read in a lot of the

research that after my sister if indeed

she did survive the chemotherapy

treatment in order to be prepared for

the bone marrow transplant she still

would have a long recovery and with lots

of dangers and the biggest danger would

be if she would reject my bone marrow

once it was transplanted in or maybe my

bone marrow would attack her attack and

rejection rejection and attack these are

the two words that come up in a lot of

the literature and I thought wow that

sounds familiar

um especially with sisters and siblings

like that’s what we’ve done our whole

life with each other we’ve either

rejected each other or attacked and I

thought I wonder if we could do some

kind of ritual or therapy or something

where we would relive our childhood

together and visit how we rejected or

attacked each other and like put it

aside and work through it and walk into

a field of unconditional love and maybe

we could teach ourselves to do the same

thing once they’ve been transplanted and

I had to be careful recommending

to my sister because she’s not like me

and didn’t have the same interests and

the same compulsion to go deep all the

time she had sort of a bemused attitude

about my work and books but she was very

very into this idea and so we did over

the course of many months what we called

our soul marrow transplant yeah tell us

more about this the soul marrow

transplant and how did I mean what and

what was involved in this as as you kind

of opened up to each other well um well

first of all I’ll just tell you what I

mean by soul cuz it’s kind of a loaded

word well it was for my sister I had

explained to her what I meant you know

the ancient Greeks believed that every

human being came into life as a baby

with something they called the genius

which was like this indwelling spirit a

guide almost that if you got in touch

with it and especially if your parents

and your school your culture helped you

like determine oh that’s that’s his

genius he’s like this let’s help that

person discover exactly who he is not

who we think he should be or the other

siblings are like or or the culture

needs like oh let’s let’s promote the

indwelling genius and that’s the way I

relate to the word soul like we each

come in with this shining seed of who we

are and then parents try to help us fit

in try to make us fit in schools do

siblings do and layer by layer we cover

the soul the authenticity the authentic

seed of who we are and and then we

relate to each other kind of

surface-to-surface so this our soul

marrow transplant though it’s what my

sister and I did with the help of the

therapist

was we we tried to show each other

exactly who we were and that included

how we hurt each other and what we

really had been thinking why we did some

of the things we did you know for

example there were quite a few years in

our young adulthood when my sister

rejected me and I couldn’t be close with

her and I never knew what it was but I

never bothered to ask her either you

know the way we just kind of build up

these stories believe them and never

check them out and as it turned out her

reason for doing that was such a painful

one for her it really had nothing to do

with me it had more to do with her

marriage and what if her husband wanted

her to do but she never told me that I

never told her my hurt and what was so

amazing about our experience was and

this was made easier in a way because of

the life-and-death nature of what we

were doing was that all she had to say

was oh my god I didn’t know you were

hurt this is why I did it

and just hearing that everything

disappeared all the years of pain and

rejection disappeared and there we were

together like our souls intact relating

to each other soul to soul so that’s

what we called our soul marrow

transplant and so by the time we went

into the bone marrow transplant we felt

really ready to give and receive

interesting so I just want to read a

small passage from from your book it’s

part of your your field note that well

the field notes are my sister’s words

the field notes are my sister when I

started writing the book you know

memoirs a very we’re very dicey risky

form to write and in this case it was so

much about my sister I wanted to get her

approval and I was reading her early

versions of the book and she also wrote

and she wanted me to

perhaps include some of her writing in

the book and that’s what we call her

field notes okay let me

I really am really touched by this

passage so I I want to I want the

listeners din to hear it field notes

March fifth now that it’s a possibility

I have to decide about the transplant I

feel trapped with no way out damned if I

do damned if I don’t I’m frozen in place

my hair is falling out I’m down to

ninety five pounds I hurt everywhere in

my body and in my heart today I saw my

daughter we were driving down the road

with the intention of going shopping

my only go goal for the outing was to

stay positive

but as I drove I began to break down and

we when we pulled over I could no longer

contain my crying it goes on I mean this

book is so touching why take this why

why bring it to this format why write a

book about it well that’s the question

anyone who is called by memoir asks

herself or himself every day of writing

you know I I kind of answered that

question the way a mountain climber

would answer why would you climb that

mountain in the middle of winter like

what would you do that and they say

because it’s there and for me the it

that’s always there are the deep deep

questions of life life struggle

suffering joy bliss letting go death I

let me tell you I would way prefer to

write cookbooks or a book about knitting

or something but I am called to the deep

I always have been I was as a child and

when I wrote my first book the Seekers

guide it’s a very big book and it’s very

researched but I also used my own life

as a seeker weaving through it not very

much of my own life but some and people

would say to me oh I loved your book

actually I didn’t read the whole thing

actually I just read those stories about

you and so I thought well if I write

another book I probably since I write

about the very deep human issues I

promised write more about myself so when

I wrote broken open how difficult times

can help us grow I ended up writing it

as a memoir and my difficult times the

biggest one I wrote about in that book

was getting divorced and becoming a

single mother and um lo and behold much

to my surprise it became a New York

Times bestseller and I was on Oprah

several times and suddenly all of my

dirty laundry was flapping in the breeze

for everyone to read about and it didn’t

really bother me about myself

I don’t mind revealing my about myself

but I felt really bad for my family

members and my friends because when you

write about difficult times you end up

writing about people and so I vowed I

will never write a memoir again like I’m

just sick of writing about myself I feel

sorry for my family but I was wanting to

write about this idea of authenticity

and I tried to write it as a novel I

tried to write fiction I spent two years

working on a novel and now I look back

at it and I think oh my god I should

have finished that novel because it was

about a woman politician trying to be

authentic in a world of disingenuous

Ness and that would have been very

relevant today but I just couldn’t

wrestle a novel that formed to the

ground is just like not my form and then

when I went through this experience with

my sister each one of us trying to offer

the other one our our most authentic

clear loving self I thought well here’s

the form to write a book about

the truth of authenticity like what does

it really mean to be authentic and how

can we do it with each other

because if all we’re doing in trying to

become authentic is about me me me it’s

I’m not interested in that I’m more

interested in what would happen if we

all related to each other from our core

selves didn’t hide out from each other

who weren’t embarrassed about being who

we were were accepting of the others

authenticity that’s what I’m really

interested in so that’s why I wrote the

book okay okay you’re also a segue

artist you’re going into broken open and

seekers guide to which I have questions

for but let’s let’s stick with

authenticity because this is this seems

to be your main kind of message that you

seem to be relating here so why don’t we

define that what is how do you define

authenticity I’m fine authenticity has a

way of uncovering it’s a path I don’t

think one should hold out in front of

oneself this idea that I will finally

get to Who I am and I will rest there

and then I’ll know it’s more a path of

constant uncovering at the very very

very deepest core of who we are is

something that I almost hesitate to talk

about because it sounds kind of cheesy

and unobtainable and that’s that we are

all one we are all a fabric together but

on the way to that when we we get out of

the way our shame of our body our

discomfort with our eccentricities all

the voices in our heads who tell us

you’re bad if you’d want that you’re

good if you do that all the way that

we’ve been conditioned to exist in

family and culture

it’s uncovering those voices and seeing

okay

some of them really maybe me but some of

them aren’t who am i if I really just

allow that shining seed to take root and

blossom and grow where would it lead me

what would I do if I was listening to

that inner voice so it’s the great art

of uncovering and a beautiful thing

about being an authenticity seeker today

is that there’s so many ways to conduct

the search psychotherapy to me is like a

holy type of seeking trying to quiet the

voices who who give us bad advice

healing the body is a way of uncovering

the soul because often what we’ve done

is our physical ailment is actually a

way of defending against what we’re

feeling you know a lot of people who say

they overeat so they don’t feel they

don’t take care of themselves on taking

care of the body healing the body making

the body strong making the body vibrant

can be a way to uncover the soul and so

can the traditional religious and

spiritual parents there was a there was

a TED talk that you did that I found

really remarkable you you said something

that I found really remarkable at the

beginning of the TED talk you said that

there was within the room that there

were 600 people but there’s actually so

many more because in each one of us

there’s a multitude of personalities and

you said that in yourself you have two

primary personalities that are in

conflict and conversation and you call

them the mystic and the warrior can you

can you define that a little bit

more for us yeah and actually that sweet

spot where the mystic and the warrior

meet that’s close to what I would call

my authentic self and that’s often the

case in people like there are a lot of

conflicting ideas and proclivities and

we’re afraid to marry them all see what

would happen so for me my mystic self I

was born with my mystic self and by

mystic I mean someone who allows the

mystery of human existence to kind of

work on me and I’ve always wanted to

explore the mysteries Who am I where did

I come from how do I live while I’m here

where do I go when I die this is the

mystic the mystic is someone who

fearlessly wants to explore those

questions so that’s alive and well in me

and I was raised by social activists and

intellectuals and my parents truly

believed and in their own life lived out

this ethos of you must give back to the

community

you must stay aware you must work for

justice my mother was very involved in

anti-war and social justice movements my

father was a naturalist and an

environmentalist and I often think like

I had like Rosa Parks and Henry David

Thoreau as my parents like that’s what

we were raised to do and to be so I took

up very with a lot of energy that called

to always give back to the community but

I also had this much bigger picture of

human life which was the mystic part of

me and when I got to college I felt

those two urges in diametrically opposed

to each other

the MS

stick said drop out of life go become a

nun

just follow the spiritual path and the

activist in me was very angry and what

was going on in the world and I wanted

to do something about it so that idea of

like all as well that’s what the mystic

feels all makes sense all as well don’t

stress don’t worry and then the angry

one who wanted to do justice in the

world they have been in conversation my

whole way yeah Wow it’s so powerful you

know I just there’s you know there’s so

much kind of advice and I mean you

you’ve been around so many people who

and you know and you’re at the beginning

of this conversation we kind of talked

about you know how we’re all kind of the

same and we tend to put the people that

we look up to on two pedestals and

there’s a lot of hero worship that

happens there do do you notice that

happens with yourself do you notice that

happens towards you with it from other

people oh that’s such a great question I

I’m shocked when it happens toward me

and I’m kind of I guess I’m kind of

naive about that on a couple of levels

one I have worked so hard not to do that

with other people and I’ve had a great

opportunity to make that a practice not

to put people on pedestals not to do

that because one it’s not the truth no

one no human being no matter how famous

or rich or learn it or wise or

experienced no one is immune to the

struggle of being human everyone

struggles the wisest people have moments

of dark depression and despair and the

most famous and rich people can be

miserably

happy I mean I’ve met the greatest

relationship experts in the world who

are getting divorced and I’ve met the

you know organization guru whose car is

a mess as she drives into the Omega

parking love like it’s just and this

this has never really upset me or made

me cynical it’s more like oh my goodness

human beings are a mess we’re all a mess

and we’re all trying and we’re all

looking for help but just because

someone can help you doesn’t mean

they’ve got it also not and I know this

because I’ve met the greatest helpers in

the world so when people put me on a

pedestal I think it’s kind of silly

but I also have become more and more

comfortable with accepting the role of

someone who has walked a few steps

farther on this path and and I do indeed

have skills and wisdom to offer so I try

to hold it very lightly yeah I agree I

really do believe that you have a lot of

wisdom to offer and that’s a very humble

stance that that you’ve taken on your

position on just of holding other people

in that regard I love it

so I mean Elizabeth II I mean Omegan Stu

was do you started this in 1977 so it’s

39 years ago for decades this is a long

time running I mean what what is your

vision for this and what has been the

vision for this and where is it where is

it kind of going and from here on well

fortunately for me there’s a whole crew

of people now running Omega on a

day-to-day basis I used to live and

breathe it and work it 24/7 in the very

beginning we didn’t know what we were

doing we’re a bunch of young people

running after a dream and it

taught us everything we know and we made

no money and we’re real visionaries

zealots and it has grown into a real

institution and it has a very large

staff now and other people who are

running it and they could more clearly

tell you the vision for today although I

will I will tell you some things about

that because I am involved still but

what we always envisioned it to be and

and what we have always strived to make

sure it maintains is a sense of

community you know the the church where

the synagogue used to be in this country

like the place where people went at

least once a week to feel part of

something bigger than themselves like a

tribe of explorers of the human

condition at least once a week you could

go there and there would be inspiration

and solace and tradition and ritual and

that just does not exist for most people

anymore and that is a human need the

sense to belong to a group of

like-minded people exploring what it

means to be alive and we often joke at

Omega like our catalog comes out every

year and there’s more than 300 workshops

and trainings in the catalog and we joke

that it’s really one workshop and then

we just stick different words in it and

of course that’s not true because there

are things like learning acupuncture or

learning African drumming or the whole

thing in-between but what we mean is

that what people are really coming for

is because Omega gives them an oasis in

this supercharged world this busy busy

connected world this world where you

never put your cell phone down and

you’re working all the time and you’re

just trying to get through the day

Omega gives you a respite an oasis where

you can come and relax and disconnect a

little and

talk to people on a deeper level people

will always say to me I met someone at

lunch in the dining room and I think I

know her better than I know my best

friends because we just immediately went

deep together and that’s that’s our

purpose it’s always been our purpose to

create a community of like-minded people

who are learning and growing together

and you know over the years different

subject matters percolate up to fit the

needs of the culture and over that I’d

say the past eight years maybe 10 I

don’t know we have we have felt the need

to do what we’ve called the movement

from me to we that we have really

perfected workshops about taking care of

yourself and now we’ve really wanted to

guide people toward self-care meeting up

with care of our world which is in such

a need of wisdom and care and that’s why

a lot of our initiatives now besides our

regular workshops which we maintain are

things like a lot of work for veterans

responding to vets coming home with PTSD

and while working with them we have a

Women’s Leadership Institute that is

helping women learn how to trust their

voice in leadership so that maybe we

could do power differently and another

big part of our curriculum is

environmental work training individuals

and municipalities and other

constituents to have a lighter footprint

so I mean what does this taught you I

mean it so I mean you’re not running it

now but you were you co-founded it and

you or the core of it for a long time so

what did it what did it teach you to

organize something that now is affecting

so many people

well let’s see you know of course I’m

the most mundane level it taught me

quite a bit of the subject matter

because my job for most of my years

there was programming choosing our

faculty and also writing our catalogue

so I would have to take large books and

turn them into pithy little to paragraph

descriptions of a workshop or a

professional training so I learned a

whole lot about a whole lot of subjects

from science and brain science and

different religions and music and art

and so I have kind of a broad knowledge

of a lot of subjects but um I think I

think what it taught me the most is the

idea of working really really hard for

one thing really choosing something to

focus on and giving it your all all of

your concentration and study and work

and love and you know people will often

ask me like how do I find my purpose in

life that’s a very loaded question but

my answer probably disappoints them

which is just pick something something

even if it’s a little close to your

heart and work on it for 20 years

work on it really hard and you will be

given so much you’ll give be given way

more than that one thing because there’s

a great joy in in completion and seeing

things to the end and doing something

that serves other people so that’s one

of the big lessons for me is picking

something and sticking to it I mean it’s

the same thing as you could say for a

marriage that that if you’re always

looking for that work to be the perfect

thing before you commit you’re never

gonna find it but if you commit to

something that’s pretty darn good but

not perfect you get to perfect yourself

Wow so profound so you know Elizabeth I

it’s it’s kind of hilarious to me

sometimes because we get we get a lot of

emails here at the show and a lot of

different types of feedback and you know

people people kind of just expect the

show to kind of run and even when even

when the guests kind of come on you know

just they just expect everything to work

properly they have no idea that I’m that

I’m working you know like eight or nine

different knobs here and making sure the

levels are right and and then all

everything that is behind the engine

that you know that we’re kind of

creating here and is there something

that that you kind of connect that

analogy to yes well the first thing that

comes up is and I’ve learned this from

working at Omega with a lot of different

people we have a large staff and when

you’re in a leadership position the

people who work with you really want you

to know what they’re doing they want you

to see what they’re doing not because

they’re narcissists because as you say

people are always doing way more than

you think they are always what it takes

to do one thing takes 40 things and as I

have stopped as a leader and turned

around and looked at the people who work

with me and really seeing what they’re

doing so that they are seen and I know

what my business really takes to run

it’s a really important aspect of

leadership to do that with the people

you employ to really know what they’re

doing and I the the law of work to me is

that everything takes longer and ever

is working harder than you think and

give everyone that benefit of the doubt

now of course there’s always charlatans

and lazy people but most people are

working their tail off and you just

don’t know it Elizabeth

you know we’re we’re about 40 minutes in

to the interview and if there’s one

thing that you could kind of give to

someone who’s made it this far into the

episode and what I mean what what is

something that you would give someone

who is you know struggling with

self-doubt has has trouble with finding

sort of their life mission someone who

is struggling I mean what do you do what

do you tell to that what do you say to

that person

well the first thing I say and I’m gonna

sound like a broken record is that you

are not alone there is nothing uniquely

screwed up about you and that that

secret shame we carry around that

everyone else was given the instruction

book that but we weren’t is really

crippling because on top of the general

difficulty of being human we add this

layer of everybody else hasn’t figured

out we don’t you know you know the poet

Rumi he always talks about the open

secret and by that he means we we all go

around hiding this big secret from each

other and that secret is almost a joke

because it’s not really a secret we all

try to hide from each other that we wake

up confused that sometimes we fail we

are sad a lot we don’t know what to do

we don’t know if we’ve made the right

choice we struggle we fail we fall but

we try to hide that from each other so

you meet a friend on the street and you

say hey how are you oh I’m great how are

you oh I’m great and both people are not

great they have something going on

that’s that’s you know hurting their

heart but since one said great then the

other says great and then we walk away

and both are thinking something like god

I wonder why she has it all together or

oh I bet her kids are all doing great in

school and and it’s it’s not that we

need to all go around and complain to

each other all the time but by hiding

the sense that we suffer we miss out on

real help and connectivity and intimacy

and and we have this secret shame all

the time and I really believe that

letting go of that and owning your

humaneness with

a sense of humour and a sense of

belonging to this odd life we live our

living that is way more than half the

end to the suffering now that’s that’s

only half the way but by putting down

that burden of thinking that you’re

uniquely screwed up all sorts of helpful

hands come to help you because suddenly

you’re just being a receptive human

being and there’s a lot of help out

there and I feel it’s like angels appear

for the one who is vulnerable and open

and real and that may sound whoa whoa

but I have experienced it in my own life

when I put down defensive nough sand

disingenuous –mess life rushes in to

help me so that’s the greatest greatest

advice I have yeah Wow love it you’re

really big on meditation you have a blog

a toolbox for daily life where you kind

of just post stuff that people can use

one of the things I guess you would say

it would be medicine is meditation

why is meditation so important well for

me it’s been really important some

people get the same effect from other

kinds of spiritual tools so you don’t

have to meditate but for me meditation

has been a tremendous friend and I’ve

done it so much now that I can access it

in a second just by shifting my posture

or breathing in a certain way but it’s

the kind of practice that you know it’s

the word practice like you practice to

be a great basketball player by doing

drills or scales on the piano

meditation is a practice so that you can

become skilled at the art of living it’s

not you don’t meditate to like become

the best meditator or have like the

hippest

yoga mat or something the practice of

meditation is the the best way I can

explain it in a quick way is you look at

the posture in the great iconography of

religions like the Buddha with his

straight back or Joan of Arc on the

horse lots of different religions have

this same posture in their leaders which

is a strong straight back a warrior back

but the front the heart is open and soft

and you see this both in paintings where

you actually see the heart like Mary in

her straight back and her blue veil but

her heart is illuminated so the practice

of meditation is a straight back meaning

I am strong and a very very soft and

open heart and when I meditate after

years of doing it working with different

teachers what I do is I take that

posture and I feel like I’m riding on a

horse and I am so balanced and so strong

in my back but I’m so sensitive that I

can feel even a tiny wind in my heart

and that’s what meditation has taught me

how to be both strong and boundary and

clear and clean and also open and kind

and good and compassionate and I can say

those words and you can hear them

intellectually but the practice of

meditation actually teaches you how to

be both strong and soft it’s beautiful

it’s perfect

that’s one of the best definitions of

meditation I’ve ever heard I want to I

want to give you the chance to kind of

if you could if you could go back to the

25 year old Elizabeth lesser and give

her one piece of advice one one thing

that you could tell her would there be

is there something that you would tell

her

well you

that wonderful poem from Rilke Rainer

Maria Rilke or he says it’s in his

little tiny book it’s a great book it’s

called letters to a young artist I think

that’s what it’s called and he says well

I can’t tell you that

now he’s writing he’s probably 50 and

he’s writing to a 25 year old artist

something like that he’s like I can’t

tell you what to do

cuz you wouldn’t be able to hear it

because that’s not what you’re supposed

to hear now you’re supposed to be

confused now and then he tells him live

the questions now and then one day maybe

you will find yourself living in to the

answers so I guess I would say to my 25

year old self like don’t be freaked out

by those questions that are really

tricky I have to admit of life and death

and what should I do and who am i and

who should I marry and should I stay

married and just live really fully into

those questions like know that everyone

has those questions and live them out

and be fearless and brave and somehow

trust that you will live into the

answers Oh God so beautiful I I don’t

know how to ask anything else eh I think

we should pretty much wrap it up there

Elizabeth where can where can people

find your work your website the book

well my book comes out on September 20th

my new book mero my other books are on

amazon and other bookstores of course

and my website is elizabeth lesser dot

o-r-g ok guys we have been talking to

mrs. Elizabeth lesser the book is called

marrow a love story comes out on

September 20th you can pick that up on

Amazon and book stores Elizabeth is also

going to be doing a book tour make sure

you get to her web

site elizabeth lesser org to find out

where she’s going to be if you’re

interested in seeing her thank you guys

so much for listening this is the human

experience we will see you guys next

week

you